October 7, 2026

The Senate President, the Presiding Officer, and the Senator-Judges of the Impeachment Court.

The Sergeant at Arms is directed to make a proclamation.

All persons are commanded to

keep silent under pain of penalty while the Impeachment Court is in session for the trial of Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte.

The Impeachment Trial of Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte is hereby called to order. We shall be led in prayer by Senator Judge Raffy Tulfo.

Almighty Father, as we begin another long day of trial, please send your most Holy Spirit upon each one of us to guide us in our proceedings. Use our eyes and ears to discover the truth, guide our minds to understand what is being discussed, and warm our hearts to have patience for each other and have compassion for the people for whom we perform our duties today. We especially pray for our witnesses who sacrificed their time and energy to help us achieve our roles here today. Finally, give us enough light moments throughout the day to remember that we are all humans and equal before your eyes. All these we pray in your mighty name. Amen.

The Clerk of Court will now call the roll.

Ehercitot, Estrada, Go, Ontiveros, Lacson, Lapid, Legarda, Marcoleta, Marcos, Padilla, Pangilinan, Sotto III, Tulfo Erwin, Tulfo Raffi, Villanueva, Villar Camil, Villar Marc, Senator Judge Zubiri, the Presiding Officer, Senator Judge Escudero, the Senate President, Senator Judge Cachalian. The

14th Senate Judge is present. The Chair declares the presence of a quorum. In accordance with the Rules of Procedure on Impeachment Trials, the Chair now recognizes the duly elected Presiding Officer to preside over the proceedings of the Impeachment Court.

Thank you, Mr. Senate President. If there are no objections, we shall dispense with the reading of the October 5 and 6, 2026 Journals of the Senate. sitting as an impeachment court and considered the same as approved.

The clerk of court will kindly call the case before this court.

Case number 004-2026 in the matter of impeachment trial of Vice President Cyrus D. Ramon Duterte.

Appearances of the parties.

Good morning, Your Honor. Same appearances for the prosecution.

I presume it will still be Attorney James?

Yes, Your Honor.

Good

morning. Good morning, your honor. I am David Ronell Golla. The same appearance for the respondent accused.

Will it be attorney CJ?

No, your honor. At this point, we will be turning over to attorney Roberto Batungbacal, your honor.

What's his nickname?

Attorney Robby, your honor.

Rob.

Attorney Rob, you are recognized.

Good

morning, your honor.

Good morning. Call your witness. Is it Arcy James Gonzales, attorney James?

Good morning again, your honor. Yes, Your Honor, we are calling to the witness stand, Ms. Arcy James Gonzales, the branch manager of Asian United Bank Davao Toril Branch.

Kindly situate Ms. Arcee James, no, rather, Arcy James Gonzales. Mr. Arcee James,

Your Honor.

Mr. Arcee. Sorry, yung kilala kong Arcee kasi babae.

Pero may James nga naman.

Is he the only witness in the gallery?

Yes, your honor. It appears to be that way.

Yes. Kindly exclude the other witnesses. However, the sergeant at arms is directed to facilitate the succeeding witnesses that will be called before the witness stand in seriatim. I think you already have a copy, General Corpus.

Clerk of Court is directed to administer the oath.

Please raise your right hand, sir. You, Arcy James Gonzales, do swear that the evidence shall give in the case now pending between the Philippines and Vice President Cyrus Guillermo Duterte shall be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. So help you God.

Yes, Your Honor.

Kindly sit down.

What's your nickname, sir?

RC na lang po.

RC.

Naunawaan mo ba, RC, yung inyong pinanumpaan kaugnay sa pagbibigay niyo ng testimonya ngayong umagang ito?

Yes, Your Honor.

Your offer, Atty. James, would be the same as your offer yesterday without any additionals?

We confirm that, Your Honor.

Atty. Rob?

Your Honor, we also adopt the comments yesterday, Your Honor.

Since it's the same, anyway. Your witness, Atty. James?

Thank you, Your Honor.

Your Honor, apologies.

Yes, Atty. Rob?

Just a quick request. May we request for expediency and...

For better administration that the documents that the witness would be identifying would be with him throughout the testimony. Just in case we need to confront the witness, it would be easier.

Assisting counsels are so directed to approach the witness and continuing authority is so given. And the counsel for the panel for prosecutors is directed through his assisting counsel to kindly prepare the documents already for the perusal of the witness and with the other witnesses you will be presenting today.

We confirm that, Your Honor, and for the record, I will be assisted today by Attorney Patrice Sitchon, Your Honor.

Yes, and continuing authority is given, as I said, to counsels for both parties. You may proceed, sir, with your direct examination.

Thank you, Your Honors. Good morning again, Your Honors. Again, I would beg your forbearance as we will be working our way up starting with AUB this morning. Mr. Witness, good morning, sir RSC. Would you, for the record, Mr. RC, would you mind telling the Honorable Court your full name, designation, and the branch or bank that you are representing today?

Good morning, everyone. I am Arcy James Gonzales, branch manager of AUB Davao Toril branch.

And as branch manager of Davao Toril, just briefly, what are your primary functions and responsibilities?

Yung primary functions ko po is oversight over

Oversight ng transaction records.

Parang part ako, owner of the business. I'm running the branch.

oversight and running the...

I mean oversight ng mga

records and documents, transactions, parang ganoon.

Since 2024 pa.

Early

2023 to 2024.

Alright, that's two years. Based on your records, Mr. Witness, how many accounts does the Vice President and or his husband, Atty. Carpio, have in your branch?

Apat po.

Can you please provide?

Dalawa po yung active.

Okay.

Dalawa na lang po yung active. Are you in the position to confirm na yung active na account ay may last digits 4387 at 0301?

Pwede ko pong tignan yung notes.

Please, Your Honor, with your permission.

You may do so, Mr. Arcee.

Yeah, thank you.

4387, and 301. That's correct po.

Yes. And

under whose name are these accounts?

Some accounts po is under Mance Carpio. Yung isang account po is meron po siyang kasama.

All

right. So let's focus on these two accounts. I want to ask the year-end balance of these accounts, Mr. Whitmas, and allow me to go year by year on this matter. Sige po. Let's start with the account number ending 387. For 2022, based on your records, how much is the ending balance of this account?

As of December po, it's 314,059.1.

2022, Your Honor. We're starting with 2022.

Okay.

Again,

Mr. Witas.

Thank you. 314,059.17.

Alright. How about for the account ending 301? What is the ending balance for the year 2022?

It's 1,682,094.21.

Alright. What was that again? 1682. 1682. Okay. Now let's go to the year 2023.

What is the ending balance of The account ending 387 of Atty. Carpio for 2023?

It's 470869.30.

Alright. How

about for the account ending 301? What is the ending balance?

It's 1774663.58.

1774663.58. Thank you, Mr. Witness. Now for 2024, what is the ending balance of the account ending in 387 of Atty. Carpio?

It's

456,352.28.

Alright. How about for the account ending in 301 for 2024? What is the ending balance?

It's 867,291.90.

Alright.

I'm almost done, Mr. Witness.

No problem.

For 2025, what is the ending balance of the account number ending in 387?

For 2025 po, zero na po.

Alright, zero na for 387.

Oo, kasi nag-close na po siya.

Na-close na siya in 2025.

That's fine. Okay. So sa yung isang account naman po na ending 301, ano na po yung ending balance niya for? 20-25.

It's 871,998.77.

Alright. So for all those years, again, 371? Tama po ba?

871 po.

871.

998.77. Alright. I think that would be all my questions for you today, Mr. Witness. That would be all for this witness, Your Honor.

Cross, Attorney Rob?

Yes, Your Honor.

Mr. Gonzales, good morning.

Good morning.

Mr. Gonzales, you mentioned these two AUB bank accounts, correct? And these are under the names, both accounts are under the names of Manases R. Carpio, is that correct?

Both accounts have the names of Manases Carpio, po.

Yes. And you confirmed that Sara Z. Duterte is not a holder of any of these accounts that you mentioned, correct?

That's correct, po.

Thank you, Mr. Witness.

Mr. Gonzales, you also talked about the balances of these accounts.

Yes, sir.

You confirmed that these numbers represent transactions done using these accounts, correct?

That's correct, Pa.

Yes. But you confirmed that your knowledge of these transactions and these amounts is only based on the Documents that you have on your records, correct?

That's correct.

You do not know why the transactions were made, correct?

That's correct.

You do not know the underlying contract or agreement for these transactions, correct?

Yes po.

In fact, these transactions were allowed by the bank, correct?

Yes, po.

Because at the time the transactions were made, the bank did not see anything wrong with them, correct?

Yes po.

No further questions, Your Honor.

Mr. RC, malaming salamat po. Senator Judge Sotto is recognized.

Just for my clarification, Mr. Presiding Officer, Mr. Senate President, sabi niya kanina yung isang account kay Tony Carpio and then the other account is Tony Carpio also and another person. Yan na sinabi, narinig ko eh. Sino yung other person?

You said earlier, and another.

I think he mentioned attorney.

Your Honor, if I may.

Kindly answer, Attorney James.

I think, Your Honor, though, I'm just surmising, Your Honor, I think the witness is worried to give the answer because it might include the name of the children, Your Honor. Is that correct, Mr. Witness?

Yung names na po yung hindi po sila sakop sa pila.

Ah, okay. So, that was the answer. So, it's

another name. and not vice president.

Pero may iba.

Yes, Pa.

And you're not authorized to or you're not supposed to tell us. Sino

yun?

Yes, Pa.

Thank you. I just wanted to clarify. Parang may iba eh.

Thank you. Mr. Arcee, maraming salamat po sa inyong panahon sa pagsagot sa mga katanungan at sa inyong pasensya at pagpahintulot na dumalo sa pagdinig ng hukumang ito. Your excuse, sir.

Thank you.

Thank you very much, sir. Kindly call your next witness, the Clerk of Court through the Osayas, directed to bring Edeli D. Umayam to the witness stand.

Your Honor, may I just manifest your honor? Given the ruling of the presiding officer yesterday, the prosecution would be dispensing with the two witnesses because I understand, Your Honor, that some of the accounts contained in these branches are already closed.

Which one would that be?

I think for both, Your Honor, the accounts under Davao Tagum Branch and Ortigas Green Hills Branch.

Ah, so these two witnesses can be dispensed with?

Yes, Your Honor. Given that we will not be asking them questions, they were only to be presented for authentication, but given your ruling, we are happy to dispense them and excuse

them.

So,

Edeli D. Umayam and Jerilee Mae Sanidad are dispensed with?

Yes, Your Honor.

Atty. Robby, any comment?

Your Honor, in that case, I am turning over to Atty. Lindon Miguel Bacquel.

Atty. Lindon, again. We see each other again, Atty. Lindon.

Good morning, Your Honor.

Good morning. Ma'am Edeli, yung po ba nickname ninyo?

Yes, Your Honor.

You are excused. Hindi na po magpapatuloy niyong pagtestigo. Paumanhin ko na abala kayo. Nagpunta pa kayo dito kahapon at ngayong araw.

Pero

tingin ko mas maganda na yun kesa naupo kayo dyan. Hindi po ba?

Yes, Your Honor.

Sorry, Your Excellency, ma'am. Salamat po sa inyong panahon at sa pasensya na po sa abala. The Clerk of Court is also directed to kindly inform Ms. Jerilee Mae Sanidad that she will no longer be testifying and that she is excused from these proceedings.

Your next witness, Atty. James, is Irene Ishida.

We confirm that, Your Honor, representing the Philippine Savings Bank.

The Clerk of Court is directed to kindly bring and situate Ms. Irene Joy Ishida to the witness stand.

The Clerk of Court is directed to kindly administer the oath to Ms. Ishida.

Ano po ang palayaw ninyo? Sit down, Ma'am.

Irene po, Your Honor.

Irene. Irene, Ma'am Irene, naunawaan niyo po ba yung inyong pinanumpaan kaugnay sa pagbibigay niyo ng inyong testimonya sa umagang ito sa harapan ng hukuman ito?

Yes, Your Honor.

Your witness, Atty. James, same offer or any additional to your offer?

Same offer, Your Honor. We confirm.

Atty. Lindon?

Same comments and objections, Your Honor.

Permission to proceed, Your Honor. Your

witness, Atty. James?

Thank you po. Madam Witness, good morning, Ma'am Irene. For the record, could you kindly provide us your full name, your designation, and the branch or bank you're representing today?

My name is Irene Joy C. Ishida. I am the department head of the branch operations of Philippine Savings Bank.

And as the department head of the branch operations of PSB, briefly, what are your primary functions and responsibilities?

My department supervises the operations of the branches of PS Bank. And as part of my function as the department head, I ensure that branches are able to strictly adhere to the policies, the internal controls, the regulatory requirements, and the standards set by PS Bank.

Alright, that's wonderful.

Could you kindly confirm to us, Madam Witness, how many bank accounts does the Vice President have or his spouse, Atty. Carpio, with PS Bank, based on your records?

There are ten accounts, Your Honor.

Ten accounts. How many are active?

There are four active accounts.

Are you in the position to confirm that these accounts include PSB, peso, time, deposit? ending in the last digits are 3853 under PS Bank Wilson.

May I refer to my notes, Your Honor?

Your Honor, the witness is asking for permission to refer to -

Yes,

ma'am, you may. Continuing authority is granted to the witness to refer to her notes. You may do so, ma'am. All

right. Madam witness, again, ending in 3853 peso time deposit under PS Bank Wilson.

Yes, Your Honor.

Under whose name is this account?

The account number ending in 3853 is under the name of Sara Zimmerman Duterte.

Alright. How about, are you in the position to confirm that a bank account, peso, passbook savings ending in 2107 under PS Bank Davao, Madraso, is in your records?

Yes, Your Honor.

And under whose name is this bank account?

The account number ending in 2107 is under the name of Manases Reyes Carpio.

Alright, thank you Madam Witness. Madam Witness, our process today is that we're asking the ending balances of these accounts on the basis of years. So it's a year-to-year. So allow me to ask this question. For 2022, and I'm zeroing in on the account ending in 3853, For 2022, what is the ending balance of this account?

For account ending in 3853, for the year ending 2022, the ending balance is 2,029,237.88.

Alright.

2,029,237.88. How about for the account of Atty. Manasa-Scarpio ending in 2107 for the year 2022, what is the ending balance?

For the account ending in 2107, the ending balance for the year 2022 is 473,845.96.

473,845.96. Now let's proceed to the next year, 2023. For the account under the name of the Vice President, Sara Z. Duterte, what is the ending balance for 2023?

For the account ending in 3853, for the year ending 2023, the balance is 2,080,023.45.

Alright. How about for the account ending in 2107? What is the ending balance for 2023?

For the account ending in 2107, for the year ending 2023, the balance is 503,550.96.

Alright.

For 2024, going back to the account under the name of Sara Z. Duterte, for 2024, what is the ending balance? For 2024?

For account ending in 3853, for the year ending 2024, the balance is 2,133,658.78.

Sige po. Para naman po kay Atty. Carpio, ending in 2107, what is the ending balance for 2024?

For account ending in 2107, the ending balance for the year 2024 is 480,076.09.

Alright.

I'm on to my last questions, Madam Witness. For 2025, what is the ending balance of the account ending in, with the last digits, 3853 for 2025?

For the account ending in 3853 for the year 2025, the ending balance 2,188,222.18 And

lastly, for the account with last digits 2107 under the name of Atty. Carpio, what is the ending balance in 2025?

For the account ending in 2107 for the year 2025, the ending balance is 259,792.87

Alright.

Your Honor, may we just object to the showing of any total because it's not contained in the witness's testimony, Your Honor.

May I comment, Your Honor?

I was

about to point that out to an inquiry. Yes, Attorney James,

before the Chair makes a

ruling.

Yes, Your Honor. These are just mathematical descriptions of the numbers, Your Honor. It is well within the courts. prerogative as a matter of judicial notice because mathematics is part of science, your honor. To take

note on this, your

honor.

Alami, alami. This is okay for the court.

Yes, thank you.

But it's the next slide that's not. When you total, I think with the previous witness, you had a total showing the per year.

Yes, your honor.

That is what the court will not allow. And if at all, Attorney Lindon, that's what the court will not allow because it would be unfair to total the ending balances for 22, for 23, 24, 25 because... These are for different years. So kindly omit that last slide which I saw with the previous witness. But this one we will allow because it's simply a mathematical total which we would most likely be doing manually anyway. It saves us the time. But kindly instruct the tech or your person in the tech to avoid showing the totals of the years. That is not an accurate depiction anymore of

what the witness testified.

Thank you, Your

Honor.

May I ask the tech booth to remove Your Honor in order to comply with the... May

isa ka pang slide na tinototal niyo eh. With the previous witness, there was that one eh.

Okay, that's okay, Your Honor. So this is okay. This

is fine. Because it totals the ending balances of the spouses in 2025.

Okay.

Yes, that's okay.

Alright, thank you, Your Honor.

That would be all from me, your honor, for this witness. Thank you, Madam Witness.

Cross,

you may proceed when you're ready.

Good morning, ma'am.

Ma'am, you provided the ending balance for these two accounts, correct? You provided the two year ending?

Yes, sir.

You can determine the balance of the accounts in your bank for a particular period. Is that correct statement, ma'am?

Yes, sir.

But your records would not be able to determine the purpose of the amounts inside the account, correct?

Yes,

sir.

The

bank records would not determine whether the funds were held for another person or entity.

Objection, Your Honor. The witness is incompetent to answer that.

She may

answer that she's not aware. Witness may answer. Irene, if you know.

I'm sorry, sir. May you repeat the question?

The bank

records would not show whether funds in these accounts were held for another person or entity, correct?

Yes, sir.

And for account ending 2107, bank records would also not show that the vice president is aware of these accounts, correct?

Yes, sir.

No further questions, Your Honor.

Ma 'am Irene, maraming salamat po sa panahon. Pasensya at abala na nagbigay namin at naidulot sa inyo sa pagtestigo nyo sa umagang ito at pagdalo kahapon na hindi naman po kayo nakapagtestigo. Thank you for your time, ma'am. We appreciate it. Your excuse, ma'am.

Your next witness is Atty. Aguilar?

Yes, Your Honor. We confirm the witness is Atty. Ninia Ferren Aguilar of Metropolitan Metropolitan Bank and Trust Company or Metro Bank.

Yes, Attorney Justin is

recognized.

Good morning, Your Honor. Same appearance with the court's permission.

Same

appearance also, Your Honor.

Kindly administer those. Attorney Bantug.

Ma'am, kindly raise your right hand. You, Niña Feren Aguilar, do swear that the evidence you shall give in the case now pending between the Philippines and Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So help me God.

Yes, I do.

Kindly sit down.

Atty. Aguilar, how shall we refer to you? Niña?

Niña po.

Niña. Atty. Niña. Nakunawaan po niya inyong pinanumpaan kaugnay sa pagbibigay niyo ng inyong testimonya sa umagang ito sa harap ng hukuman ito.

Yes, Your Honor.

Salamat po. Your witness, Atty. James, but is the offer the same?

Same offer, Your Honor, for the record.

Atty. Justin?

Same objections, Your Honor, and same comments.

Duly noted, you may proceed with your direct, Atty. James.

Thank you, Your Honor. Madam Witness, Atty. Ninia, good morning po.

Good morning po.

Ma'am, for the record, what is your full name and your designation in the bank that you're representing?

I am Niña Feren Alquiroz Aguilar. I am the Head of Anti-Money Laundering Division of Metro Bank.

Sorry, Head of Anti-Money Laundering Division?

Yes, sir.

As head of the Anti-Money Laundering Division, what are your primary functions and responsibilities?

I oversee the bank's compliance to the Anti-Money Laundering Act including its implementing rules and regulations.

Madam Witness, you caught my attention because you are the head of the Anti-Money Laundering Division. So far, those that are presented here are either the branch manager or the operations. May I know why you were sent as the representative of Metropolitan Metro Bank?

As the head of the Anti-Money Laundering Division, Sir, I have access to all the records for the accounts subject of the subpoena.

Okay. And how long have you been the head of the Anti-Money Laundering Division?

Over a year already, Sir.

Alright. So what you mentioned a while ago is that the accounts subject of the subpoena is under your division, the anti-money laundering division. Is that right?

Our division has access to the records

of

the account.

Yeah, that's fair. Madam Witness, I'll be asking some questions on the bank accounts of the vice president and or his husband and including perhaps their kids. But in order to not name the kids, you can just say Mr. A, Mr. B. I guess we can take notice that these are Bank accounts in the name of the kids because we also do not want to put their names out in the public. Is that fine?

It's fine,

sir.

Thank you po. Sige po. Based po sa records niyo sa Metro Bank, ilan po yung bank accounts ng ating Vice President ng kanyang asawa at ng kanyang mga anak kung meron man?

Can I confirm with my records?

You may refer to your notes to clarify, Atty. Nina. Sorry, I'm not familiar. Only children below 18, if any, because that's what's included only in the SALN. Would that be correct, Atty. James?

I confirm that, Your Honor.

Atty. James, Atty. Justin, that would be more accurate, right?

That would be correct, Your Honor.

Any account of a child above 18 should be excluded already?

Yes, Your Honor. I think that is under the SALN rules and the law.

Exactly. You may proceed, Atty. Niña.

Alright.

Thank you, Your Honor. For the current and savings account, combine Vice President Sara and Man Scorpio's account. There are six bank accounts under those individuals, including the accounts open for their children.

Alright, six. How many are active, if you know?

Three, sir.

Three. And can you give the last digits of those three active bank accounts?

The first one is ending 3876.

The

second one is ending in 2445. And the last one is ending in 5263.

5263. Okay, so allow me to ask questions on those three active accounts. Let's start with the last digit. or the account ending 3876. But for the record, under whose name is this account?

This is a joint account of Attorney Manases Reyes-Carpio or Vice President Sara Zimmerman-Duterte.

Alright. How about for the bank account ending with digits 5293? Under whose account or under whose name is this if you are at liberty to say?

It's, just to clarify sir, it's 5263.

5263.

This account is under the name of one of the children.

Alright, that's fine. How about the account with last digits 2445? Under whose name is this?

This is under the Vice President Sara Zimmerman Coterta's name.

Alright. Sige. Let's now go to the ending balance, Madam Witness. For account number 3876, under the name of Atty. Carpio and her wife, Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte, what is the ending balance for the year 2022?

Based on our records, sir, the ending balance as of 2022 is 2 million.

278,832 pesos and 33 centavos.

Okay. How about for the account with last digits 2445 under the name of the Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte? What is the ending balance?

As of 2022, it's 85,556 pesos and 33 centavos.

What year is that? 2020?

2022

sir.

How about for the last, the account with last digits 5263 under the name of one of their children? What is the ending balance for 2022?

For 2022, under the account ending in 5263, for 2022 the ending balance is 1,184,168 pesos and 2 centavos.

Alright. Let's go to 2023, Madam Witness. Again, start with the account with last digits 3876 under the name of the Vice President, Sara Duterte, and her husband, Atty. Carpio. What is the ending balance for 2023?

For 3876, sir.

Sorry, can you say it in thousands or millions?

This is for the account 3876?

3876, yes.

For 2023, it's 2,436,156 pesos and 69 centavos.

Okay. For the last digits 244, bank account with last digits 2445? Under the name of Sara Zimmerman Duterte, what is the ending balance for 2023?

For 2023, sir, it's 85,556 pesos and 33 centavos.

Alright. Sige. How about for the last, for the account with last digits 5263? Under the name of their, one of their children, minor children, what is the... Ending balance for the year 2023? For

2023, it's 1,330,800 pesos and 53 centavos.

Sige. Let's go back again to account with last digits 3876 for 2024. Ano po yung ending balance nitong 3876 na bank account?

For 2024, the ending balance is 330,896 pesos and 40 centavos.

Okay. For 2024 again, but this time with the bank account ending in 2445, what is the ending balance?

For 2024, it's 85,581 pesos and 89 centavos.

How about for last digit, for bank account with last digit 5263, what is the ending balance for 2024?

It's 1,458,423 pesos and 9 centavos.

Lastly for the years 2025, if you can just go quickly Madam Witness, para sa 3876 na bank account, ano yung Ending balance?

It's 55,273 pesos and 18 centavos.

Alright.

For 2025 with bank ending in 2445?

The balance is 85,625 pesos and 29 centavos. And

lastly for the bank account with last digits?

5263. What is the ending balance?

It's 1,459,162.56 pesos.

1,459

,162

.56 pesos. Could you read the total of those, Madam Witness? If that is accurate, would you know?

I don't have the total balances in my notes.

That's

okay. We'll just proceed.

I think that would be all for this witness, Your Honor.

Your witness, Attorney Justin?

Nothing to cross-examine, Your Honor, except we would like to object to the flashing of the separate totals on the screen pertaining to all banks, Your Honor.

Kindly avoid that part.

Thank you, Your Honor.

That

is the proper subject matter of your next witness, I believe.

May

we ask that it be taken down, Your Honor, since several bank officials will be presented, they don't have personal knowledge on all those bank accounts. That would be improper.

But you can include

the total per year per account, Attorney James.

Yes. Thank you, Your Honor. But, Your Honor, can I see again the slide there? I'm not sure which one was it.

Your Honor,

we

are

objecting to the flashing. It showed

totals per

bank.

Per bank?

Per bank. She's not competent to testify on the other banks.

From previous banks, okay.

But kindly consult with your panel what they showed.

Okay, Your Honor.

Atty. Nina, maraming salamat po sa inyong panahon at paumanhin sa abala. Salamat sa pagsagot sa mga katanungan na magkabilang partido. Yes, what is the pleasure of Sen. Risa Hontiveros?

You wish to make interjections,

ma'am?

Mr. Presiding Officer, opo, just a couple.

Yes, you have two minutes, ma'am.

Salamat po, Mr. Presiding Officer. Magandang umaga po, Atty. Nina.

Good

morning, Your Honor.

Good morning ma'am. Na-peak din yung interest ko dahil nga kayo yung head ng inyong anti-money laundering division so dalawang tanong lamang po sa inyo.

Kahapon po kasi napag-usapan yung suspicious transaction reports o STRs na ginagawa ng mga covered persons kasama ang mga bangko sa AMLC. So, in general po, sa karanasan ninyo bilang head ng inyong anti-money laundering division, basta ba may kontrobersyal na balita tungkol sa kliyente ay nire-report na yan agad, agad-agad sa AMLC bilang STR? O kinukonsidera po ba? Nang covered person, in this case ng bangko, yung circumstances ng transaksyon. Circumstansya kasama na po yung halaga, account activity, profiles ng nagpadala, at tumanggap ng pera at iba pa. Ganun po ba yun?

For suspicious transaction reporting based on negative media, we generally file a suspicious transaction report if we have identified our customer to be the subject of the negative media and conduct further review on the transactions. And if it is warranted, we would file additional suspicious transaction reports after the review of the transactions, Your Honor.

Hindi rin basta-basta. Kung may negative report pero identified yung customer bilang subject ng negative report, maaaring nagpo-file ng STR pero nagko-conduct ng further review if warranted. So may ganung mga qualifications step by step.

Yes, Your Honor.

Alright po. Then huli na lamang po. Again, in general, yung mga suspicious transaction reports, yung mga bank teller po ba? Ang nagpapadala ng mga suspicious transaction reports agad-agad sa AMLC? O dumadaan po ba yan sa internal review? Kanina nabanggit niyo further review. Dumadaan ba sa internal review? May escalation process po ba? May approval po ba ng mga boss ng covered person o ng bangko bago i-report, i-forward ang report sa AMLC?

The suspicious transaction reports, Your Honor, goes through my division, anti-money laundering division, and would require my approval as well before filing with the AMLC.

All right. So dadaan pa po sa division ninyo in the case of your covered person, in the case of your bank, and then kailangan pang-aprubahan ng head of division na kayo po yun.

Yes, Your Honor.

All right. Salamat po, Attorney Nina. Salamat po, Mr. Presiding Officer.

Thank you, Senator Judge Risa. Yes, Senator Judge Kiko Pangilinan is recognized.

Thank you, Mr. Presiding Officer. Magandang umaga.

Good morning, Poa, Your Honor.

Madam Witness, just to follow up on some of the points raised or questions raised by Senator Hontiveros.

In the guidelines for suspicious transaction reporting, you are familiar with the seven criteria, no? Kunwari. Halimbawa, there is no underlying legal or trade justification. Tama. So apart from negative media reports, you would look at this particular guideline and say yung deposit na ito malaking halaga and it appears na walang underlying legal or trade or economic justification.

Among others, Your Honor.

So in other words, negative media is one consideration in filing suspicious transaction reports. Of course, and you'll go through the guidelines.

Yes, Your Honor.

And when you say, and we do further investigation or further, what was the term you said? Sorry.

Review, Your Honor.

Review. Your review is based on the guidelines.

Yes, Your Honor.

Okay. So, hindi...

Binubusisi nyo ng gusto dahil you're careful na hindi rin tama na mag-file ng suspicious transaction report kung mali.

Yes, Your

Honor.

O walang basis o dahil news report lang.

Yes, Your Honor.

So, maingat ang bangko bago ito mag-file ng suspicious transaction report. Binubusisi ninyo ng gusto.

Yes, Your Honor.

Hindi base sa chismis.

Yes, Your Honor.

Maraming salamat.

Thank you, Senator Judge Kiko. There being no other Senator Judges who wishes to make interjections, Atty. Nina, you're excused and may I just say kayo po yung pinakakalmado at malumanay na testigong so far nakaharap po namin. Maraming salamat. Naway mahawa po kaming lahat sa inyo. Yes, Senator Judge Villanueva.

Sorry, Mr. Presiding Officer. Just one question because I wanted to...

You may proceed, sir.

Thank you very much because I wanted to take this moment to ask this very particular question to our witness who is also considered an expert in anti-money laundering activities. Madam Witness, may mga CTRs and STRs na nare-report na... Kagaya po nung last time nandito po kami, if I'm not mistaken, yung BPI po was mentioned na nagkaroon ng glitch or reporting error involving a manager's check and then was later corrected after the bank identified a system bug. Gusto kong malaman na Madam Witness, meron po ba kayong ganitong experience so that we can be informed before the court relies on these amounts appearing in the CTRs or the STR, suspicious accounts. Yung bangko po ba can confirm that these have been checked against the underlying account statements and Transaction records. At kung nagkaroon po ng error, kung sakali po na nagkaroon naman ng error in the original report, ano po yung ginagawa ng bangko in processing this information for correcting or withdrawing the CTR or STR previously submitted to AMLA?

Your Honor, we have not experienced that kind of error at least in my term as the head of anti-money laundering division of Metro Bank. But in case there would be any, we would file an amended covered transaction report as part of our procedure.

And sinasabi niyo ho, and puntahan ko yung binanggit kanina ni Sen. Kiko, talagang masusi at talagang maingat na maingat. Bago po ito i-submit. Kaya in your experience, hindi niyo po na-experience ito.

Yes, your honor.

Maraming salamat, Madam Witas. Thank you, Mr. Presiding Officer. Thank you.

Yes, ganyan talaga pag nasimulan na natin eh. Senator Judge Raffy is recognized. Madam Witas,

since kayo po isang expert.

You may proceed, sir.

Thank you, Mr. Presiding Officer. Since kayo po isang expert sa banking industry. Ano po yung protocol ninyo kapag meron halimbawang cliente ninyo mag-withdraw ng more than 500,000 at kapag meron pumasok sa account niya ng more than 500,000?

For cash payout, Your Honor, our requirement for more than 500,000 is to conduct enhanced due diligence. At least for the current policy, it's already 1 million following the circular 1230 of Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas. We conduct enhanced due diligence on the transaction to ensure that we understand where the payment is going to.

So meron kayo hinihingi ng mga dokumento kung para saan pupunta yung pera ngayon?

We get information and documents as may be necessary, Your Honor.

Halimbawa kung meron pumasok na pera by the hundreds of millions, ano usually ang protocol?

We also conduct enhanced due diligence on the transaction and obtain additional information and documents as may be necessary to Prove the legitimacy of the source of the funds, Your Honor.

So tinatanong niyo yung nag-de-deposit sa account kung para saan at saan galing yung pera ngayon na dinide-deposit sa isang account?

Yes, Your Honor.

Anong mga dokumentong hinihingi niyo halimbawa?

It depends on the type of the transaction, Your Honor.

Example?

So, for example, for fund transfers, if it is, for example, a payment from a supplier, we ask for copies of the invoice or the contract between our depositor and their counterparty to prove the legitimacy of the transaction.

Very good. So, yan yung protocol sa lahat ng bangko, hindi lang sa bangko ninyo, per BSP regulations?

I

will not be able to answer for the other banks, sir.

Okay. Last na lamang. So, kapag halimbawa, Nag-withdraw ang isang account holder sa kanyang account ng say 10 million. So anong protocol ulit?

depositor to provide us additional information as to the rationale why they are withdrawing that amount and provide documentation to support the legitimacy of the transaction or the withdrawal.

The

reason why I'm asking her, Mr. President and Officer, kasi kahapon, may mga pera galing sa iba't ibang bansa pumasok sa account ni BP Sara by the millions and hundreds of millions, as a matter of fact. So I was wondering kung yung bangko na Pinasukan ng pera from abroad kung sinunod yung ganong klaseng patakara na binanggit ni Madam Witness. Hininga ng kontrata, sales invoice, etc. because it wasn't discussed yesterday. So I was just wondering. Thank you, Madam Witness. Thank you, Mr. Presiding Officer.

Thank

you, Senator Judge Raffy.

You are excused, Attorney Niña.

Your Honor, before that.

Before we excuse the witness.

Yes, Your Honor.

Yes, what's your pleasure, Attorney Justin?

With all due respect, of course, to

the questions

of our senator judges, just a clarification for the record in one of the answers of the witness. I believe the witness answered that when there is a negative media pertaining to a relevant person, an STR is automatically reported and she stated if warranted, further investigation is done and if after further investigation, an additional STR. is filed, Your Honor. I think that was the import of one of her

answers.

And to qualify only insofar as she is concerned in her bank because she cannot speak for the practices of other banks. Would that be correct, Attorney Justin?

Sorry, Your Honor.

It only applies to her bank, her statement.

Yes, Your Honor.

Attorney Nina, you are excused, ma'am. Salamat po.

Thank you, Your Honor.

Kindly situate the next witness to confirm, Attorney James.

It is Leslie Cham of Security Bank.

Kindly situate Leslie Cham of Security Bank.

To the witness stand, the clerk is directed to administer the oath to Mr. Leslie.

Your Honor, also, pardon, just to set the record straight, Your Honor, with all due respect again to our two senator judges. We'd just like to clarify, Your Honor, that based on the evidence propounded, the foreign currencies alluded to did not enter the bank accounts of the Vice President, but was, I think, the Cale88, Your Honor, just to clarify the record.

Yes, and the Court has, I think, has taken note of that. Manifestation is noted.

Thank you, Your Honor.

Kindly administer the oath to Mr. Leslie.

Sir, kindly raise your right hand. You, Leslie Cham. Do swear that the evidence you shall give in the case now pending between the Philippines and Vice-President Sarah Zimmerman Duterte shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So help you God.

Yes, Your Honor.

Thank you. I presume your nickname is Leslie as well?

Les.

Les. Mr. Les, did you understand the oath that you just made in connection with the testimony you'll be giving before this Court this morning?

Yes, Your Honor.

Thank you.

Offer, Atty. James?

Same offer, Your Honor, from the prosecution.

Atty. Justin?

Same comments and objections, Your Honor.

Duly noted. Your witness, Atty. James, for your direct.

Yes, Your Honor. And before I ask, Your Honor, I beg your kind indulgence. I understand that these are numbers and that there are a lot of it, so I beg the forbearance of our honorable members of the court. But based naman po sa lumalabas, lumalaki-laki na rin naman po.

Sir Les, can you kindly tell your full name and your current designation in Security Bank, please?

I'm Leslie Y. Cham. I'm the branch banking group head of Security Bank.

Thank you. We needed some energy, sir. Thank you for that energy.

Branch banking group head. Branch banking group head. What are your primary functions and responsibilities?

I actually supervise the overall branch banking of the bank with regards to the distribution channel. So we are handling sales and service.

Okay. And how long have you been working in that capacity?

18 years.

18 years. Congratulations, sir. And before that, have you been a part of any other institution, banking institutions, or have you been with security bank?

Oh, I've been with other institution in the past.

And can you, for the record, just inform us? Konting ano po para malaman namin?

I started with the Citytrust Banking Corporation, then I moved to PCI Bank, and then to Standard Chartered Bank. Chinatrust, and Security Bank.

Alright. Certified banker, I guess. Sir, I just have a few questions on the ending balances of the Vice President. But could you confirm to the Honorable Court how many bank accounts does the Vice President and or her husband have with Security Bank?

Your Honor, based on our documents, Vice President Sara Duterte Does not maintain any account with security bank.

Okay.

How about Atty. Carpio?

Atty. Carpio has two accounts with us.

How many of those two accounts are still active?

Only one.

And are you in the position to confirm that this active account ends with the last digit 4534?

Can I take a look at the notes?

You may, sir. Continuing authority is granted to the witness to look at his notes.

Sir, what's the number again?

Last digit, 4534.

Okay. Yes, this is an account of a checking account, All Access, opened in October 22, 2020. Sorry, opened in, yeah, October 25, 2022.

Alright. But you mentioned that there are two active accounts, is that correct?

Yes. No, only one active account.

Only one.

The other one is already closed.

And this is a peso account?

That's correct. Both are peso accounts.

No foreign accounts?

No foreign accounts.

All right.

Allow me to ask questions on this account that you've identified under the name of the Vice President's husband, Atty. Manases Carpio. More particularly, just the ending balances, sir, if you can assist us on this. For 2022, sir, what is the ending balance of This account with last digits 4534.

As of December 20, 29, 2022, the ending balance is 25,074.34.

Thank you. I'm sorry I got distracted. For 2023, what is the ending balance of this account?

The ending balance of the December 2023 is 232,134.27.

Alright. And for 2024, sir, what is the ending balance for this account under the name of Atty. Carpio?

344,388.90.

Alright. How about for 2025? What is the ending balance? of this account under the name of Atty. Manases R. Carpio.

935,923.41.

Alright. I'm about to end, Mr. Witness, but would you be in the position to confirm to us if a certain entity such as an entity named Cale88 maintain foreign bank accounts with your bank?

Without saying the account number of course. Cale88. Are you in the

position to confirm?

No,

I'm not in the position to confirm

any FCDU account.

Alright. But that answer is based that you do not have the records now. Not because it's not there.

Objection, Your Honor. The witness has already

answered. Just clarifying,

Your Honor. That he cannot disclose on foreign currency deposit.

Already answered, counsel.

We'll just move on, Your Honor. Yeah, that would be all from me, Sir Les. I thank you for your patience and for being here today. Thank you, Your Honor.

Cross-Attorney Justin?

Nothing to cross-examine, Your Honor.

The Senate President is recognized for his interjection. He has two minutes.

Thank you. Thank

you, Mr. President. Mr. Leslie, kahapon ang aming witness ay AMLAC. At nakita ko doon sa kanilang report ng security bank, nag-issue ng STRs. sa Cale88. One of the STRs na nabasa ko dito, nakasulat, 12 cash deposits amounting to total value of 29, hindi mabasa, will be filed through STRs as these pertain to the fresh funds are not commensurate with the declared financial profile of the customer. Can you explain to us, unang-una, bakit kayo nag-file ng STR? With this particular transaction, anong ibig sabihin o anong nakita niyo dito sa not commensurate with the declared financial profile of the customer?

Yeah, your honor. As advised by our legal counsel that if it's regards to the STR and CTR, I am not allowed to disclose any information pertaining to that. I think this is covered under the AL.

AMLC's confidential restriction.

Nag, but do you know kung nag-file, kahapon lumabas, but do you confirm na nag-file kayo ng STR on Cale88?

I cannot confirm.

And then there's another STR, actually multiple STR final ng security bank sa Cale88. Yung isa,

Maraming nakasulat, but the main point here, however, the client failed to provide supporting documents and remained unresponsive to the request for clarification, which resulted to the bank being unable to validate the source and purpose of the transaction. Can you give us details on this?

Again, since this is not part of the subpoena of the STRCTR, I don't have any data to that, sir.

You cannot give us information as to the reason why Security Bank filed the STRs?

I don't have right

now.

Alright,

thank

you.

Thank you, Mr. President.

Thank you. The Chair confirms the answer of the witness in that regard that they are covered by the confidentiality rule on divulging submissions pertaining to CTRs and STRs as a covered institution. Senator Judge Pangilinan, sir, nice.

Yes, earlier, good morning, Mr. Witness. Earlier, you mentioned that you are not allowed to disclose information regarding, as advised by your lawyer, of course, foreign currency deposits. And this is in reference to Cale88. Does Cale88 have a peso account with security bank?

Cale88?

Allow me to check.

Yes, please.

Yes, it appears that Cale88 has two checking accounts but was closed already as of this point in time.

So these are peso accounts?

It's a peso account.

And therefore you can testify as to the transactions of the peso account in an impeachment trial?

Yeah, peso

account.

When

was it closed?

It closed on July 2026.

Oh, just recently.

Because the account was only opened October 2025 also.

Okay, so would you have figures as to the amounts of the peso account of Cale88 in your records?

The one that I only have

is the ending

balance.

Yes. What was the ending balance when it was closed?

The ending balance is for the account of 2013 is 332,530.95 and the other account is 8581 is 21,164.27. Ending balance of December 2025.

The

first one is August 2024. The second one is October 2025. Both close at July 2026.

Peso accounts from 2024.

Transaction reports.

Meaning, you know, the withdrawals, the deposits. Would you have that?

Right now, I don't have because largely these are all system generated and I don't look into the day-to-day transaction of it. So, I was not able to have that transaction in place.

Well, we will leave that to the lawyers. or maybe later on, the court. But it would be interesting to know, you know, the bank transactions undertaken by the Cale88 from 2024 and 2025.

Because that was, at that, when it was opened, Vice President was already Vice President. And when it was closed, of course, 2026. So from 2024 to 2025 to 2026. It would be interesting to get the information as to the amounts that went in and out, considering that in the AMLA report, about 319 million pesos went in for transactions from China. We don't know if that was through the peso account or if that was through the dollar account, of course, but that would be... something that is worthy of looking into.

With

the permission of Senator Judge Pangilinan and Senator Judge Aquino, kindly complete it already, Mr. Les. 2024 ending balance of the account of Cale88, you only gave 2025.

Okay.

For the 2013, 2024 is 332,530.95 and for December 2029, 2025 is 16,987.59.

For 2024,

ending balance?

No 2024 since the account was actually just opened.

So, you only have one ending balance which is 2025?

2024 and 2025.

Okay.

Senator

Judge Bam Aquino

is recognized.

Maraming salamat, Mr. Presiding Officer. Magandang araw, Mr. Witness. Since na-bring up na rin po ni Senator Pangilinan yung Is it Kale or Kale88? Kale88 or Kale88? Naalala ko, dun sa pinakitang suspicious transactions ng AMLA, nakalagay doon na naging suspicious siya dahil no economic justification. So, can you explain to me what does that mean? No economic, not necessarily on this account, but in general, when does... A transaction becomes suspicious and when do you attach the terminology no economic justification? Ano pong ibig sabihin nun?

If we have actually a huge transaction coming in or the deposit, then normally we ask for a proof of source of income or where it come from. So I think that's where the proof should be obtained by the

client.

And that's standard for all transactions with other countries? Humihingi tayo ng, is that a contract? Anong dokumento po yung hinihingi po ninyo dyan?

It depends. So if it's a, let's say, it's a transaction, it's a sales of property, then we ask for the deed of sale and the contract of lease or contract of sale. So those are the documents that we look. and to make sure that the account or the money that you are going to deposit is legit.

Okay. And in the case of exporters or food manufacturers, it would be a contract?

That's correct. Type finance

contract or a sales invoice in that level.

Is that a requirement? Just to check, sir, is that a legal requirement? Is that a bank requirement? Is that an AMLA requirement?

It's really a bank requirement and industry requirement.

Okay, so hindi naman siya iligal kung wala kang ibigay na kontrata? Is that correct?

No. Actually, we

don't transact without any documents.

Oh, but, well, in this case, nakalagay no economic justification. So, ibig sabihin nun, walang dokumento. So, paano nakapasok po yung pera kung wala po mga dokumento?

In this case, actually, I don't have the details, sir. So, maybe I would like to just take a look at it on your question with regards to that particular

question.

Okay, so can I repeat that? So, in a usual case na merong kumpanya magbibenta ng produkto sa ibang bansa, bago pumasok yung pera, humiingi po kayo ng...

Proof of payments or proof of remittance.

And if no proof is given, you do not accept the remittance?

Yes. We don't accept.

But

there are cases na pumapasok ito kahit walang dokumento?

No, no, sir. Usually, we actually return the money.

Was the money returned in the case?

I don't have the figure, sir.

Okay. So ang sinasabi ninyo, hindi pwede makapasok yung pera kung walang dokumento. But coming from the witnesses the other day and with your testimony today, mukhang wala naman pong dokumento. Paano nangyari ho yun?

So

I cannot actually determine right now to your question sir because I don't want to speculate of what had happened because I'm not also clear wherein the money is returned or retained.

Okay. In the case where no documents were provided and ginawang suspicious transaction, how do you reckon that in your bank, in security bank, Mr. Witness? Ang tingin nyo ba doon ay mali? Irregular? Dapat bang i-resign? I'm not sure what the terms are but ano hung determination ninyo kapag may transaction na ganoon?

Sir,

if there is any doubt of certain transaction, we actually, the frontliner, refer it to our compliance office and they will determine and to help us decide whether this is illegal

or not.

Last question, and in this case... For the transaction na matagal na pag-uusapan dito na may pumasok na pera galing sa Chinese companies, was there any determination on security bank's part that this should be brought up to the compliance office or checked again?

Yes.

It was?

It was.

Alright. Salamat po.

Thank you, Sen. Judge Aquino. While we are on this point, Chair instructs the Clerk of Court. Clerk of Court, to distribute the document information requested by Senator Judge Zubiri yesterday on the names of the companies from the various European companies that were part of the CTRs and STRs. The additional requests, Senator Judge Zubiri, for the mainland China and Hong Kong companies are still being processed since that request was made belatedly. Senator Judge Tulfo, will you make an interjection?

Yes, sir.

You are recognized, sir. You may proceed when you're ready.

Mr. Witness, kanina nasabi mo kay Senator Judge Kiko Pangilinan yung ending balance ng peso account ng [unclear], right, noong 2024. Pakiulit?

Okay. The 2024 is 332,530.95.

Pero dito sa forensic report, it says 40,138,520 in 2024. Mukhang hindi ata nagtatali.

Sir,

I actually am mentioning the amount. Based on our bank records, sir. So I don't have any idea about that 40 million.

No, it's an ending balance, Mr. Les.

Yeah,

the ending balance of what we have is 332,530.

Not what was maintained in the account in the course of the year or what entered in the account in the course of the year. Would that be correct, Mr. Les?

Yes, this is the ending balance.

The ending balance.

So, itong 40,138,000, ito yung pumasok at lumabas na pera sa account ng Kale or Kale88 for the year 2024. Am I right?

Let me just check it.

Ito ba yung nagja-jag sa records mo?

Transaction.

Yeah, the transaction record shows in 2024. Yes, it's talking about 40,138,000. 766.28

Exactly.

So yan yung pumasok at tumabas na pera. Ang

lumabas is 40,001,101.79 Ang

lumabas. Ang pumasok total for the year 2024, how much? From January to December 2024?

40

,001,101.79

Yung

pumasok.

Ang

lumabas.

Ang

lumabas 40 million.

Yes.

Ang total pumasok

40,138,766.28.

So halos parehas lang.

Yes.

Okay. Sa

2025?

Sa 2025, ang pumasok is 6,265,915.66.

Yan yung total? Pumasok at lumabas?

Yes, pumasok na

total.

Okay, sige. Last na

naman, Mr. Witness.

Now, alimbawa may nag-deposit sa account.

Peso account ng Cale88 na say 5 million. Ano yung protocol ninyo?

5 million ang pumasok.

Example, example lang. Just an example. Anong mga hinihingi nyo documents?

In this case, we also look into some supporting documents to prove of that 5 million came from. Because importante kasi we look at the also the source of funds coming in. So we actually also ask from the client any supporting documents.

E paano kung wala yung client at tumahog yung manager niyo, tumahog yung vice president ng bank, papasukin mo na yan. Kami ng bahala.

We don't do that. In fact, if there is any ambiguity on that, we always refer it to the compliance office to make the final judgment on that.

So meron yung isang department doon who will Come up with a final judgment whether or not to accept the deposit.

Yes, to determine

that

and give the recommendation.

Wala ba kayong pulis yan na sige tangkapin na muna yan and then later on saka natin to follow na lang yung mga documents needed?

No,

we

are very strict

on the KYs in the compliance,

sir.

Thank you, Mr. Witness. Salamat po, Mr. Presiding Officer.

Thank you, Senator Judge Raffy Tulfo. Senator Judge Lacson is recognized. You may proceed, sir. You have two minutes.

Thank you, sir.

This is a point of clarification or information, I mean. What kind of account is, yeah, this is security bank account, no? 0392-J29380-001. I ask the question because it appears to differ from the account number that you testified to earlier. Kasi itong kanina, is this a checking account yung ending in 4534? that we were discussing earlier.

That's correct, sir. Are you referring

to Manases Carpio account?

Just the number, the pattern. Now, there's another account. Merong letter kasi eh, J. The account number, if you're familiar, and I would like to ask, anong klaseng account ito?

It's a checking account.

No, no, no.

0392-J29380.

Dash001. Iba po yung pattern kaya ako natanong.

Actually, it's just referring to just one account. The first account is an internal, we call it the BBN account of the client but the real account number is the 50494534.

How about the 0392J293? Something. The one that I mentioned. What kind of account is that? Is it savings?

Checking.

Checking also. Why is the pattern different?

Pattern? Because this verse that you testified to earlier, wala pong letter. The account that I mentioned, meron pong letter J.

Yun may letter J is an internal number namin ng clients. But the real account number of the client is the one that I testified with the 4534. So, we're just showing lang. But these are two numbers with just one account.

How's that? Can you explain further?

Okay. The 0392 na sinasabong J29380001 is the customer ID of the client. So the customer ID is just one. But the client can have multiple accounts using only one customer ID. So the one with the J is the customer ID. And the one that was with the 4534 is the

I'm just curious because it is stated here sa fund flow analysis merong 5.3 million in fund transfers from a certain Dio Zambrano

and

Adam Anthony Cabe III. Wala naman pong Manases Carpio. or Vice President Sara Zimmerman-Duterte. So, paano naging isang account lang yun? Eh, different persons.

Carpio. Actually, I, sorry, sir, I'm not sure about the account.

Anyway,

thank you. You answered my question. Thank you very much, sir.

Senator Judge Pangilinan, let's recognize. You have two minutes, sir.

Good

morning again, sir. Earlier, I asked about Philip Peso. accounts for Cale88 in your bank. Do you have peso accounts for the corporation GenCorp?

Yes, sir.

Okay. May we know the ending balance of GenCorp? How many accounts? Peso accounts?

Eight accounts.

Eight. Okay. How many... And

these accounts were opened when?

Okay, the first account was opened in October 2020, the second account opened in November 2020, the third account is in March 2021, then the fourth one is March 2021, then August 2023, then January 2025, then August 2025, and November 2025.

August

2025?

Yes.

And November 2025?

That's correct.

Okay.

So these are eight accounts, GenCorp.

Would you have ending balances for 2025? Are they all active?

Yes, sir. It's all active.

Up to now?

Yes, sir.

Okay. So would you have the ending balance of 2022,

2023, and 2024, and 2025?

Yes, sir. For the account of 6890, December 2022, 7,881,829.18. For 2023 is 10,674,113.05. 2024 is 9,044,516.71. Then 2025 is 3,279,422.28. The second account which is a 7044. 2022 is 2,276,435.05. December 2023 is 3,116,258.02.

2024 is 4,547,203.46. Then 2025 is 2,372,195. Third account is 7204. 2023, we don't have the number in 2022. 2023 is 3,181,032.06. 2024 ending is 5,053,327.02. Then 2025 is 4,138,640.05. The fourth account is...

How

much was that, the last one? 2025 is...

4,138,640.65.

The next account is 7215

Which number, account number 8, 9, I mean, sorry, 7, 8. You said there are 8 accounts.

[unclear] mentioned 10 accounts.

We're only on the 4th account.

The fourth account is 7215 2022 14,593,620.72 2023 is 15,658,349.55 2024 is 11,301,205.63 I don't have the figure of the 2025 right now. Then the fifth account is 6022 Starting in 2023 501,390.50 Then 2024 is one million five hundred six hundred forty-two point thirty-one Then December 2025 is 1,501,492.75 Then the next account which is 2772.

Since this account is open only in 2025, I have only 2025 ending balance which is 3,189,501.58. And the next account is 18336.

2025 is 18,656.16. And the last account Right now is 9710 is zero balance.

Okay. These are all ending.

Yes, that's correct.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you very much.

Thank you. Mr. Les, salamat po sa inyong panahon at pag-testigo at pag-sagot sa mga katanungan. Salamat din po at pasensya sa abala sa inyong kooperasyon sa hukuman ito. You're excused, sir.