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Alfredo Sotto Corpuz: Senate President, the Presiding Officer, and Senator-Judges of the Impeachment Court.

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Sen. Sherwin T. Gatchalian: The Sergeant at Arms is directed to make the proclamation.

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Alfredo Sotto Corpuz: All persons are commanded to keep silent under the pain of penalty while the Impeachment Court is in session for the trial of Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte.

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Sen. Sherwin T. Gatchalian: The impeachment trial of Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte is hereby called to order. We shall be led in prayer by Senator-Judge Robin Hood Padilla.

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Sen. Robinhood “Robin” Padilla: Bismillahir Rahmanir Rahim. Alhamdulillahi Rabbil 'alamin. Panginoon naming nag-iisa, ang nag-iisang hukom, Panginoon ng lahat ng mga daigdig, ang pinakamaawain, ang pinakamahabagin. Panginoon namin, hinihingi po namin ang inyong talino sa oras na ito. Sa oras na ito na ibinigay po sa amin ang pinakamabigat na obligasyon upang makapagbigay ng hustisya. Batid po namin Panginoong Allah na kayo lamang po ang nag-iisang hukom at ang pagiging hukom ay napakabigat na nakalagay po sa aming balikat upang magbigay ng hustisya, hindi lamang po sa mundong ito. kundi ito po ay isang bagay na dadalhin ng aming bayan sa kanyang kasaysayan. Napakabigat po nito, Panginoong Allah, at kayo lamang po ang makapagbibigay sa amin ng lakas ng loob upang magbigay ng tamang justisya sa oras na ito. Amen.

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Sen. Sherwin T. Gatchalian: Amen. The Clerk of Court will now call the roll.

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Atty. Renato N. Bantug Jr.: Roll call up members, Senator-Judge Aquino, Senator-Judge Cayetano Alan, Senator-Judge Cayetano Pia, Senator-Judge De La Rosa, Senator-Judge Ejercito, Senator-Judge Estrada, Senator-Judge Goh, Senator-Judge Ontiveros, Senator-Judge Lacson, Senator-Judge Lapid, Senator-Judge Legarda, Senator-Judge Marcoleta, Senator-Judge Marcos, senator-judge Padilla, senator-judge Pangilinan, senator-judge Sotto III, senator-judge Tulfo Erwin, senator-judge Tulfo Rafi, senator-judge Villanueva, senator-judge Villar Camil, senator-judge Villar Marc, senator-judge Zubiri, the presiding officer, senator-judge Escudero, Senate President Gatchalian.

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Sen. Sherwin T. Gatchalian: With 19 senator-judges present, the chair declares the presence of a quorum. In accordance with the rules of procedure on impeachment trials, the Chair now recognizes the duly elected Presiding Officer to preside over the proceedings of the Impeachment Court.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Thank you, Mr. Senate President. If there are no objections, we shall dispense with the reading of the August 3, 2026 Journal of the Senate, sitting as an Impeachment Court, and shall consider the same as approved.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Bago po tawagin ang presiding officer ang kaso na kabinbin sa impeachment court, may nais lamang po akong sabihin sa ngalan nating lahat.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Magkakaiba man ang ating pananaw at baga man magkakatunggali ang magkabilang panig dito sa impeachment court, may mga bagay-bagay na dapat pinagkakasunduan at pinagkakaisahan natin, lalo na dun sa mga napuya't kagabi kakapanood ng TV. At para sa akin ang isa po dito. Ayan, tagumpay at kampyonato ng ating magaling at magiting na kababayan na si Alex Ayala sa DC Open.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kaya't sa ngalan ng Senado ng mga senator-judges, mga kawanin ng Senado, sa ngalan ng magatong galing mga partido ng impeachment trial, nais po naming ipabatid. Ang aming nagkakaisang pagbati kay Binibining Alex Ayala sa kanyang panalo at kampyonato sa DC Open, tunay na ikinararangal at ipinagbubunyikan naming lahat. Congratulations sa'yo, Alex.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kaya pag may inaantok po na senator-judge,

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: malamang nanood kagabi.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The clerk of court is instructed to kindly call the case before this impeachment court.

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Atty. Renato N. Bantug Jr.: Case number 004-2026 in the matter of impeachment trial of Vice President Sara Zimmerman Duterte.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Appearances.

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Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: Your Honor, same appearance for the prosecution. I understand, Your Honor, that this is a con... Continuation of the direct examination of the prosecution's witness, Atty. Wamil. And with that, Your Honor, may we ask that the counsel for the prosecution, Atty. Lorna Capunan, be recognized.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. At the proper time, yes. Counsel for respondent appearances.

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Same appearance for the respondent accused. Good morning, Your Honors.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Good morning. Before the presiding officer calls on the counsel for the panel of prosecutors, attorney Capunan, for the continuation of his cross and the witness, the chair would like to ask if the respondent, or rather counsel for respondent, has been furnished with a copy of the motion of the panel of prosecutors with respect to the request for judicial notice.

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, sir. Yes, that is correct, Your Honors. We were furnished yesterday.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: For your information, counsel, we will hear. Your arguments for or against it and or a written opposition or agreement with that motion tomorrow. Just to give you advance information before we start the trial. So do you have enough time?

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Thank you, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: At this juncture, Chair, I would now like to recognize with the permission of the Honorable Chua, the prosecutor, rather the counsel for the panel of prosecutors, Attorney Capunan, and Chair instructs the Clerk of Court to bring the witness, Mr. Wamil, before the witness stand.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Mr. Wamil, it is understood that you will be continuing with your testimony under the same oath that you had and did yesterday. Do you understand that, sir?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Atty. Kapunan, counsel for the panel of prosecutors, you may continue with your direct examination of the witness, Mr. Wamil, of the Commission on Audit.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honors.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: To the Senate Impeachment Judges and to the Presiding Officer and Senate President, I beg the indulgence of this honorable court to start this with a recess.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The reason this is necessary, Your Honor, is because yesterday, when prosecution asked for a recess with the permission or consent of the counsel for the respondent, we started to identify and cross-check the 845 acknowledgement receipts. Unfortunately, time ran out and our assisting counsels only were able to show half. Although this court will recall that under Rule 130, Section 3, in coordination with Section 7, we were able to mark a tabulation or a summary prepared personally by this witness, Your Honor, to preempt any possible objection of the respondents and any manifestation that they were not allowed. to compare the copies of our exhibits and their own exhibits as regards the rest of the acknowledgement receipts, Your Honor, unless they will stipulate that there is no need, Your Honor, then it becomes necessary for a brief recess, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, for what purpose is the recess?

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, yesterday, when we resumed hearing yesterday, Your Honor, and we were going over these three boxes and... several folders, Your Honor. It had to abruptly stop because we had resumed session. And at that time, our associates noted that kalahati lang po ang natapos sa pag-compare.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, the presiding officer will have a query first beforehand. Yesterday, you presented a summary and a table of his findings based on the 845 acknowledgement receipts contained in the six

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: or three boxes.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: And you presented some samples.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: I count one, two, three, four, five, six, six samples, examples rather. So you mean to say you want to present more acknowledgement receipts as samples as part of the tabulation of the witness?

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: No, Your Honor. What we would like to do now and inquire from counsel for the respondent is if it's no longer necessary for your associates to look over the said acknowledgement receipts, Your Honor, if they can manifest that and to preempt any possible technical objection in the future. on their cross-examination or upon offer of this exhibit, Your Honor, because these exhibits will have to be offered in due time. And we do not want it as an objection to the offer that they were not able to compare the rest of the acknowledgement receipts, Your Honor. Now, to preempt that, if counsel is willing to forego with that potential objection, Your Honor, we are ready to proceed.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: You're talking of only the acknowledgement receipts for the period covering December 21 to December 31, 2022. Yes, Your Honor. Is that what you're referring to? I think I know what counsel-respondent will already say but yes, counsel-respondent, what is your comment on the manifestation of the counsel for the panel of prosecutors?

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, we haven't stipulated on anything so I don't see why there's a need to compare actually. We haven't stipulated on anything.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Actually, Attorney Capunan, counsel for the respondent already said yesterday that I'm just subject to cross insofar as the non-stipulated matters is concerned.

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That's correct.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The counsel for respondent stipulated on everything you asked for in your list of documents except for that. Except for the acknowledgement receipts for the period covering December 21 to 31, 2022. My understanding, counsel, is that you will be presenting samples from the tabulation or summary of the witness. And as I said, you presented already six. You may proceed to present samples or examples under each category of this table. Without prejudice, however, many they may be subject to your call and discretion given the refusal to stipulate. by the counsel-respondent, which is, of course, they would be well within their rights not to do so, given their own legal theory of the case.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We submit, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: So kindly proceed, counsel.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: With the permission of this honorable court, same appearance, good morning to the senator-judges. Mr. Witness, yesterday, you were able to identify 845 going through these documents, acknowledgement receipts. Mr. Witness.

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes ma'am. In

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: this 845 acknowledgement receipts which the prosecution marked as exhibits P-1-8-1 up to P-1-8-848, there is a portion there and I will show you a sample on the screen. There is a portion in all of these acknowledgement receipts at

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the bottom thereof. There is a signature in

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the phrase certified true copy.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can we present this witness with a sample acknowledgement receipt?

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Assistant counsel may approach from both parties. It's still attorney Peña, right?

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: I remember.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: His mother will be happy again.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can you go through some of this acknowledgement receipt, Your Honor?

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: While counsel is going over... Showing over these acknowledgement receipts to our witness, Mr. Juan Mil,

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: we would like to make a manifestation that at the bottom portion of all of these exhibits identified or being identified now by this witness, have the statement certified

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: true copy being shown on the screen.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, can you read?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: It's a certified crew copy and there is a name, Davin Bacay. Would you know who this person is?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Who is Mr. Bacay?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Siya po'y admin staff ng Kowa Ikfaw.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kowa Ikfaw. And his signature, there is a signature that appears over the name Davin Bacay. Whose signature is this?

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa kanya po. Why do you know?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Davin Bacay po. Nakita ko po siyang pumirma ng ibang dokumento at yung kanyang pirma sa mga dokumentong iyon ay kapares po ng kanyang pirma sa certified true copies.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In all of these acknowledgement receipts that you have seen or saw yesterday,

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: is it the same bakay that certified as to these photocopies being certified true copies?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. Okay.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, with that, we will proceed where we left off yesterday, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes, I believe you were able to identify already the checks and made the witness identify the checks already for the first, second, and third quarter, counsel, if I'm not mistaken.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: You may proceed, counsel.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yesterday, Mr. Witness, we had identified and you had confirmed certain land-bound checks. We will now go to disbursement checks, which you said... Disbursement vouchers, which you said were among the documents submitted by the Office of the Vice President to liquidate, to allegedly liquidate her confidential funds, if shown to you, Mr. Witness. Three disbursement vouchers. And again, with the kind permission of the court and for easy reference of the honorable impeachment judges on screen. And if you please check this copy. Being shown to you, these are stipulated documents, Your Honor, and common exhibits of both the prosecution and the defense. For the prosecution, there is a disbursement voucher dated January 31, 2023, Exhibit P-1-10-B. Shown on the screen.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Likewise, there is a disbursement voucher dated April 10, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-10-C and likewise, the Defense Exhibit. And lastly, disbursement voucher dated July 13, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-10-D.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, sinabi

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: With the indulgence of counsel, just for the record, the same pieces of evidence identified by the counsel for the panel of prosecutors are also marked, respectively, as D-133-OVP, D-1-57, rather, 30, no, no, 33-OVP, D-1-57-OVP, and D-1-82-OVP for the respondent. Counsel may proceed.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. Now, Mr. Witness, sinabi mo kahapon na itong mga disbursement vouchers ay sinabmit ng Vice President mismo ng office niya.

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Pakisabi sa atin, ano ba ang significance nito mga disbursement vouchers na nakikita natin sa screen?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang significance po ng disbursement voucher na ito, ito po kasi yung mag-initiate nung kanilang pag-process nung cash advance. Dito rin po ang nag-certify yung various signatories nung disbursement voucher.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang disbursement voucher, sinabi mo, dito nag-uumpisa ang proseso?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong proseso yan?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nang kanilang pag-withdraw po ng kanilang cash advance for the confidential fund.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Withdrawal ng cash advance, para saan periods? There are three disbursement vouchers shown on the screen and which you have identified. For clarity. Ano ang mga periods na kino-cover nitong disbursement vouchers na to?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these disbursement vouchers po, ang period covered ay yung first DV, first quarter of 2023, yung second DV, second quarter of 2023, at yung third DV po ay third quarter of 2023.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So covered ang tatlong quarters ng confidential funds.

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on these documents. We go now to another set.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Oh, there is a signature here.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Here in the middle, there appears a signature being flashed

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: on the screen. Nakalagay certified expense, cash advanced, necessary, lawful, and incurred under my direct supervision. You confirm, Mr. Witness?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Whose signature is this, if you know?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: This is the signature po of the Vice President, Sara Duterte.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And why do you know that this is her signature?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Because the Office of the Vice President submitted po the specimen signatures of the signatories of their documents and included in that submission po is the specimen signature of the Vice President and her signature po on that specimen signature is the same po with her signature on this document.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nakikita natin yung tatlong signature ng Vice President sa disbursement vouchers na yan. What is the significance of her signature in these three disbursement vouchers kung masasabi mo?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, sinertify ni Vice President na yung kanyang cash advances ay kailangan na ayon sa batas at na-include po under her direct supervision.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And ano ang observations mo? dito sa tatlong disbursement vouchers na to.

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: With respect lang po dun sa disbursement voucher for the third quarter of 2023, hindi po napirmahan yung box E, which is the receipt of payment portion.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong significance ng observation mo na to?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ito po kasi yung patunay na na-receive ni kung sino man po yung pay nung cheque, yung payment.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sa pagka-evaluate mo nitong disbursement vouchers na to, ito ba ay compliant sa joint circular na sinabi mo kahapon?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on my evaluation po, wala naman po akong nakitang findings bukod dun sa walang signature yung box E of the third quarter disbursement voucher.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Punta naman tayo sa next set of documents. Tatlo na naman to for the three periods that you mentioned. Showing to you on the screen and please go over the documents being presented by Attorney Pena. There is a liquidation report dated March 29, 2023. Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-9B.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: A liquidation report dated July 11, 2023, which is Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-9C and a liquidation report dated October 23, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-9D. A common exhibit. stipulated by counsel for the respondent yesterday, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Again, with the indulgence of counsel for the panel of prosecutors, for the record and for the easy reference of senator-judges, the three documents referred to by attorney Capunan respectively are marked as well by the respondent as D-1-30-OVP, D-1-55-OVP. D-1-80-OVP. Do you confirm, counsel?

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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I confirm, Your Honor.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, for the panel of prosecutors, attorney-component, you may proceed.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. In the middle of these three liquidation reports, there appears to be an indication, quote-unquote, certified purpose of cash advance duly accomplished. Do you confirm that, Mr. Witness?

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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And there is a signature, again, appearing on top.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: There is a signature appearing thereat. Whose signature is this?

119
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: This is the signature of the Vice President, Sara Duterte.

120
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And you're familiar with this for the same reason, Mr. Witness?

121
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

122
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now,

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: what is the significance of the statement, Certified Purpose of Cash Advance, duly accomplished? With the signature of the Vice President appearing in all of these certifications.

124
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, ang significance po noon ay sinertify po ni Vice President na yung purpose nung kanilang CASHA DAT advances ay na-accomplish po nung agency.

125
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And any observations as regards these three documents?

126
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala naman po akong nakitang findings about these liquidation reports po.

127
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Just for purposes of clarity, itong three documents are similar to the three periods, the first quarter, the second quarter, and the third quarter months that you earlier mentioned, Mr. Witness.

128
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question, ma'am?

129
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Itong tatlong, this verse, itong tatlong dokumento na nakikita mo dyan, para saang period ito?

130
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these liquidation reports, yung first liquidation report, ang period covered ay February 6 to March 29, 2023. Yung second liquidation report ay April 25 to June 30, 2023. At yung third liquidation report ay July 14 to September 30, 2023.

131
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Para maalala natin, to remind us, Mr. Witness, for these three quarters,

132
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: of the office of the Vice President for which she submitted liquidation reports. Magkano ang amount ng confidential fund per quarter?

133
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, ang amount ng kanilang quarter Likasya Advance ay 125 million pesos per quarter.

134
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ito ba ay fixed amount?

135
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, yes ma'am.

136
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At ito ba ay winidron ng buo?

137
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, yes po.

138
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Punta naman tayo sa another three sets of documents shown on the screen for easy reference and document being shown to the witness to refresh his memory. We have accomplishment report dated March 30, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-7-B. Likewise, an accomplishment report dated July 11, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-7C, and accomplishment report dated October 9, 2023, Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-7D. Likewise, Your Honor, stipulated documents, common exhibits, both for the prosecution. and the respondent or defense.

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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel for respondent, would you like to identify for the record the counterpart markings on the part of the respondent?

140
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, Your Honors. On the part of the respondent. Yes, Your Honors. These are marked as Exhibit D-1-74-OVP. D-1-50-OVP and D-1-99-OVP, Your Honor, for the record. Sorry, the first one is actually D-1-50-OVP, the second one would be D-74-OVP, and the third one would be D-1-99-OVP, for the record, Your Honor.

141
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, D-1-50-DE with respect to the 33023 Accomplishment Report, not D-1-21DE.

142
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: For the first quarter, Your Honor, sorry. Yes, Accomplishment Report. For first quarter, it's D-1-5050-OVP, not DE, Your Honor.

143
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Clerk of Court is instructed to kindly correct our records if at all it is different from what the counsel for respondent manifested. Counsel for the panel of prosecutors, attorney-cubo, n'yo may proceed, ma'am.

144
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. Now, Mr. Witness,

145
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: for

146
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: purposes, para malinawan tayo, ano yung mga periods knocking over ng tatlong accomplishment reports na to?

147
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Accomplishment report po, ang nakalagay po na period covered ay February 6 to March 29, 2023.

148
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung second accomplishment report po, ang nakalagay na period ay April 25 to June 30, 2023. At yung pangatlo po, July 14 to September 30, 2023.

149
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So tatlong quarters ng Office of the Vice President. Yes,

150
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

151
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron dito, common to all of these exhibits, flash on the screen, is the phrase, approved by.

152
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And there is a signature. There

153
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: is a signature there. Whose signature is this?

154
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: This is the signature of the Vice President, Sara Duterte.

155
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Familiar to you for the same reason, Mr.

156
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

157
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

158
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And ano ang ibig sabihin ng Nakalagay diyan, approved by, at pinirmahan ng vice president sa tatlong dokumentong ito.

159
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang ibig sabihin po nito ay in-approve niya kung ano man po yung contents nung kanilang quarterly accomplishment reports.

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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Na-approve ng vice president mismo?

161
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

162
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, for our appreciation, punta ngayon tayo sa first quarter.

163
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong observations mo? Dito sa nakikita mong first quarter accomplishment report.

164
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this first quarter accomplishment report, meron pong dalawang items dito na hindi kasama dun sa allowable confidential expenses under item 4.8 of the Joint Circular 2015-01.

165
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong ibig sabihin ng hindi allowable? Bawal? Bawal ba?

166
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Opo, kasi yung listahan po nung allowable confidential expenses under 4.8 ng Joint Circular ay exclusive. So kapag hindi po kasama doon, hindi po pwedeng paggabitan ng kanilang confidential fund.

167
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Aside from itong sinasabi mong bawal na paggamit ng confidential fund appearing in this document, meron ka pa bang ibang observation?

168
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Meron din pong line item for the payment of reward. under item B po nung kanilang actual outcome and accomplishment. At wala po silang sinubmit na any document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer as required po under item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular. So

169
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: itong linalagay dyan ng payment of reward, ang sinasabi mo, Mr. Witness, based on the Joint Circular, eh... Is this a violation?

170
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am, that is a violation.

171
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Why is it a violation again? It is a violation

172
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: since it is not compliant with the conditions of the payment of reward. which is yung dapat meron po siyang supporting document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account po ng information given by the informant. Sa

173
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: lahat ng mga liquidation documents na binigay sa'yo or sinubmit sa office ng COA-ICFAO, wala bang any dokumento na nagpapatunay na ang rewards na binigay sa informant? ay nag-result ng successful activity.

174
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, wala po ma'am.

175
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron pa bang observation dito?

176
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala na po.

177
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Punta naman tayo sa accomplishment report ng second quarter. Exhibit P-1-7C.

178
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Any observations? Ano naman ang masasabi mo dito sa accomplishment report na in-approve mismo ng Vice President Sara Duterte?

179
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Katulad po noon ako ng accomplishment report, meron din po silang line items for provision of medical and food aid at payments of incentive or traveling relative to the confidentiality. Confidential operations na hindi po among the allowable confidential expenses under item 4.8 of the Joint Circular 2015-01.

180
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sinabi mo na meron nakalagay diyan Medicines. Bakit sinabi mo na bawal o hindi allowed ito sa Joint Circular?

181
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po siya kasama dun sa exclusive list of allowable confidential expenses under item 4.8 po.

182
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano pa ang na-observe mo dito?

183
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Meron din pong line item for the payment of reward for 12 million pesos, pero hindi po siya supportado ng any document evidencing—

184
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Objection, Your Honor. Objection. I beg the indulgence of— What is the

185
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: objection of counsel?

186
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, I gave some leeway earlier to the witness, but we move to strike out the answer of the witness as far as the payment of reward is concerned. Kasi yung pinag-uusapan lang naman natin dito, on its face, kung merong mali. So utilization of confidential intelligence funds in terms of the accomplishment report. He is now going into the findings, which is not part and parcel of this form, which is the accomplishment report, Your Honor. Not yet, part of it. Not yet. So what I'm saying is the payment of reward by itself is not a violate. Indicating the payment of reward here by itself is not a violation of the Joint Circular, Your Honor.

187
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Because we are not yet, if at all, at the AOM level and or not just as well. Kindly reform, counsel. Objection sustained.

188
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Is this payment of rewards included in the so-called allowable expense of confidential funds?

189
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on item 4.8, yes, subject to the three conditions as enumerated.

190
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What are these three conditions?

191
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular, payment of rewards must be made to informers who must be non-employees of the agency concerned, subject first to the approval of the head of the agency, second to the submission of documents evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account given by the informer, and thirdly, it must be directly related to the confidential operation. At sa

192
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: mga requirements na sinabing mo, compliant ba ang Office of the Vice President?

193
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, hindi po sila nag-submit ng any document evidencing the success po of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer.

194
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Before we proceed to the third quarter and your further observations dito sa second quarter, magkano ba? Ang sinabi na amount na ginamit sa confidential funds para sa medicines.

195
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question po? What quarter po?

196
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Magkano ba? If you know. Kasi ikaw nag-evaluate. Magkano ba ang ginastos para sa medicines?

197
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For what quarter po ma'am? Sorry. For the second quarter. For the second quarter. Based on this accomplishment report po, Yung provision of medical and food aid ay nagkaka-amount po ng 40 million pesos.

198
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Magkano ulit?

199
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based po on this accomplishment report, yung provision of medical and food aid ay 40 million pesos po yung amount.

200
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa first quarter naman,

201
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: meron bang entry dyan na nakalagay medicines?

202
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Meron pong entry dito for provision of medical and food aid for 40 million pesos po.

203
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Forty million pesos.

204
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Forty-two

205
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: million pesos.

206
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Forty-two million pesos ang nakalagay diyan ngayon.

207
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

208
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa

209
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: accomplishment report na yan, meron bang inattach ang Office of the Vice President? First and second quarter na inidentify. Meron ba siyang inattach mga dokumento na nagpapatunay? na ginastos talaga yung 42 million na yan for the first quarter and 10 million na yan for the second quarter for medicines alone, Mr. Witness. Meron bang attachment itong accomplishment report na sinubmit?

210
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po

211
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: silang inattach na any document po supporting yung kanilang payment for medicine.

212
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

213
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Earlier, minention mo, meron ring gastos for traveling. Magkano naman yun, Mr. Witness?

214
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For what quarter, ma'am?

215
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the first quarter muna.

216
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the first quarter po, yung kanilang payment of incentives or traveling relative to confidential operations ay 10 million pesos po.

217
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 10 million pesos. At again, tanong ko, sa expense na 10 million na yan for traveling expenses, meron bang inattach na mga annexes? Diyan, para explain, pa paano ginastos sa travel ang 10 million? May mga... attachments ba yung accomplishment report na yan?

218
00:46:25,830 --> 00:46:27,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang in-attach.

219
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi na-explain itong 10 million, Mr. Witness? Walang official receipts attached? Meron ba?

220
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala pong official receipts na-attach.

221
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Any other observations sa second quarter?

222
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: There

223
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: you go, okay.

224
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Same lang po with the first quarter, yung findings pa dito.

225
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa third quarter naman po tayo pumunta. Exhibit P-1-17-7-D. What are your observations? Ano naman ang masasabi mo dito sa accomplishment report ng Vice President?

226
00:47:26,340 --> 00:47:33,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Meron din po silang payment of reward dito na worth 35 million pesos.

227
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pero wala po silang inattach na any document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer.

228
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Sinabi mo na walang sinubmit na ebidensya. Wala bang naka-attach dito sa accomplishment report?

229
00:47:51,460 --> 00:47:52,540
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po, ma'am.

230
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Walang report on success of the surveillance activity?

231
00:47:58,850 --> 00:47:59,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

232
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And, sa pagkaalam mo, and based on your evaluation of the provisions of the Joint Circular compliance audit ito? Compliant ba ito?

233
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:22,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po siya compliant.

234
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Bakit, Mr. Witness?

235
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Dahil wala nga pong supporting document po yung kanilang payment of rewards as required under item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular.

236
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sinabi mo 4.8 ng Joint Circular. Ito ba yung pinakita mo sa impeachment court kahapon? yung 4.8 na yan.

237
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung provision? Isa po siya sa pinakita ka po. Okay.

238
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ngayon, magkano naman? Magkano yung item na yan sa third quarter report?

239
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the third quarter po, ang amount ng kanilang payment of rewards ay 35 million pesos.

240
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 35 million pesos. Para sa isang quarter lang?

241
00:49:04,470 --> 00:49:05,210
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

242
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Para sa third quarter. Thank you, Mr. Witness. Punta naman tayo. sa next set of documents na sinabmit rin ng Office of the Vice President para iliquidate yung kanyang confidential funds for the first, second, and third quarter. I refer you now, flashed on the screen and being shown to you, are certifications submitted by the Office of the Vice President. Unang-una, certification of the Office of the Vice President dated March 30, 2023, Exhibit P-1-6-B. Pangalawa, OVP certification dated July 11, 2023, which is Prosecutions Exhibit P-1-6-C. At pangatlo, OVP certification dated October 9, 2023, Exhibit P. 1-6-D for the prosecution stipulated upon by the respondent and likewise part of their defense exhibits.

243
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, we confirm, Your Honor, and we would like to manifest that for the first quarter certification that is marked as exhibit D-1-34-OVP, second quarter That is Exhibit D-1-58-OVP. And for the third quarter, it's D-1-83-OVP for the defense, Your Honor.

244
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: And your documents are certified through copies, counsel, respondent. That is correct, Your Honor. Counsel for the panel of prosecutors may proceed.

245
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. Now, please look at these certifications. Meron nakalagay dyan sa bottom ng page, Attested. Anong ibig sabihin ng attested?

246
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang ibig sabihin po nung attested ay vinerify at could confirm po as true nung signatory dito yung contents nung certification.

247
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sino naman ang signatory na nakikita natin sa dokumentong ito?

248
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this certification po si Vice President Sara Duterte.

249
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At siya mismo ang nag-attest na tama lahat ang nakalagay dyan?

250
00:51:38,900 --> 00:51:41,320
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, yes ma'am.

251
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And you are familiar with the signature for the same reason, Mr. Witness?

252
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

253
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano naman ang mga observations ang masasabi mo tungkol sa tatlong dokumentong ito? Incidentally, Mr. Witness, what periods did this cover, again, for the record?

254
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, yung for the first quarter, yung February 6 to March 29. 2023, 42nd quarter, April 25 to June 30, 2023, and 43rd quarter, July 14 to September 30, 2023.

255
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano naman ang masasabi mo? Ano naman ang observations mo sa tatlong dokumentong ito?

256
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Since these are pro forma documents po, wala naman po akong nanote ng observations with these certifications.

257
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong ibig sabihin ng pro forma? Parang copy-paste?

258
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Naka-attach po siya as annex doon sa Joint Circular 2015-01. Naka

259
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: -attach sa Joint Circular at yun ang sinyamit nila?

260
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Naka-annex po. Yung

261
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: format. Ang tawag doon ay?

262
00:52:58,260 --> 00:53:02,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Proforma po. Naka-annex yung format doon sa Joint Circular 2015-01. Ang

263
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: tawag ko doon, copy-paste na copy-paste. Anyway. Your Honor,

264
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: we, again. With all due respect to opposing counsel, I would like to object

265
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: to

266
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Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: that characterization, Your Honor.

267
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Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: I

268
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: withdraw, Your Honor. I just could not resist myself. Now, provisions of the Joint Circular. Sinabi mo ito yung pinagbasihan mo ng mga evaluation mo ng mga documents na to. What, if any, are the violations that you observe based on the Joint Circular?

269
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: May I clarify po kung anong document po yung piniportay niyo ma'am?

270
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa lahat ng dokumento.

271
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa lahat po ng dokumento. Based on, for what quarter po? Sorry.

272
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For all the quarters.

273
00:53:56,830 --> 00:54:07,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For all the quarters. Yung first and second quarter po kasi magkasama sa isang AOM lang and then yung third quarter ay nakaseparate po yung AOM.

274
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So, punta muna tayo sa first and, sinasabi mo, Mr. Witness, na yung first and second quarter, eh, isa lang ang na-issue na AOM. Ano itong ibig sabihin ulit ng AOM?

275
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Audit Observation Memorandum po.

276
00:54:25,180 --> 00:54:25,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And?

277
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: On the Joint Circular 2015-01, yung Audit Observation Memorandum po ay yung written notification to the agency informing them of the deficiencies noted during the audit and requiring them to submit an explanation or the documents being sought po dun sa AOM or both.

278
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay, under the circular, this Joint Circular that you mentioned, ito bang Audit Observation Memorandum? Kailan ini-issue ito?

279
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ini-issue po siya upon evaluation po nung auditor nung documents at may nanote po siyang findings based on the evaluation po.

280
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Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

281
00:55:11,260 --> 00:55:40,550
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Parang meron tayong konting background, no? Kasi kahapon, meron ring na-stipulate ang respondent at ang prosecution ng mga notice of suspension at notice of disallowance for the better appreciation of this honorable court. Pakieducate kami. Pakisabi nga anong difference ng AOM, Audit, Observation, Memorandum,

282
00:55:42,140 --> 00:55:55,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: pagkatapos yung Notice of Suspension, at pagkatapos yung Notice of Disallowance. Ano ang mga pagkakaiba nitong tatlo?

283
00:55:56,290 --> 00:56:27,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: If I am to start with the definitions based on the joint circular, katulad nung na-define ko kanina sa AOM, it is a written notification to the agency concerned of the deficiencies noted during the audit and requiring them to submit an explanation or the documents being sought or bought. At ang agency po ay merong 15 days from the receipt of the AOM within which to submit their comments, justifications, or documents as required in the AOM.

284
00:56:28,340 --> 00:56:41,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So pagkatapos ng issuance ng isang audit, observation, memorandum, ang mga subject ng audit ay binibigyan ng 15 days para mag-submit ng mga dokumento?

285
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based po dun sa Rules and Regulations on Settlement of Accounts po ng COA. Yes, ma'am.

286
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:57,370
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Paano pag may sinubmit na dokumento at hindi pa rin sapat or tama or insufficient or may discrepancy, anong nangyayari?

287
00:56:57,650 --> 00:57:09,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag may sinubmit po na document at based on the evaluation of the auditor, hindi pa rin po sapat yung document na yon, then that is the time po na mag-i-issue na po ng notice of suspension. Itong

288
00:57:09,730 --> 00:57:15,150
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: anong definition ng notice of suspension sa Joint Circular?

289
00:57:15,910 --> 00:57:40,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under the joint circular po, yung notice of suspension is a written notification to the agency head and the accountant informing them of the temporary disallowance po nung disbursement sa audit because it appears that the disbursement is irregular, illegal, or improper and requiring them to submit their justifications or the documents po being sought in the AOM or both.

290
00:57:41,549 --> 00:57:47,130
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sinabi mo, Mr. Witness, para maintindihan natin, ito ay temporary.

291
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Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

292
00:57:48,380 --> 00:57:52,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on findings na irregular. Ano ba irregular? Ano yung ibig sabihin ng irregular?

293
00:57:54,140 --> 00:58:04,720
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on COA circulars po, ang irregular disbursement ay yung mga disbursement na hindi umaayon or hindi nagkocomply dun sa requirements ng mga COA issuances.

294
00:58:06,260 --> 00:58:12,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Sa Pilipino, ang tawag dito ay irregular pa rin. Tama.

295
00:58:14,180 --> 00:58:17,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Itong illegal. Illegal. Anong ibig sabihin ng illegal?

296
00:58:18,620 --> 00:58:24,000
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag sinabi pong illegal, yung disbursement po ay hindi nagkocomply dun sa applicable laws.

297
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:27,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At kung sinabi mong improper?

298
00:58:28,420 --> 00:58:36,480
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag improper naman po, ang ibig sabihin yung expenses ay either unnecessary, excessive, extravagant, or unconscionable.

299
00:58:36,700 --> 00:58:54,150
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So pag nagbigay kayo ng notice of suspension, Ito ay nagpapahayag. This means ang significance nito ay naobserve ninyo, ikaw, sa audit findings mo na ito ay irregular, illegal, or improper.

300
00:58:54,630 --> 00:58:57,010
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Leading, Your Honor. Objection. I

301
00:58:57,780 --> 00:58:59,060
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: will

302
00:58:59,060 --> 00:59:08,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: go to the next question. Pag hindi na-comply ang notice of suspension, what action, if any, is taken by your office?

303
00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:15,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag hindi po na-comply yung notice of suspension, then that is the time po na mag-i-issue na kami ng notice of disallowance.

304
00:59:16,590 --> 00:59:18,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano naman itong notice of disallowance?

305
00:59:19,350 --> 00:59:42,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the Joint Circular po, yung notice of disallowance ay yung written notification to the agency head and the accountant informing them of the disallowance noong disbursement and requiring them to restitute the amount po nung disbursement because yung disbursement ay illegal, improper, or irregular.

306
00:59:43,450 --> 01:00:13,970
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So, Mr. Witness, whether tinatawag mo ito AOM or audit observation memorandum or whether notice of suspension or whether notice of disallowance. In these three stages, nabibigyan ng opportunity ang inu-audit na agency para mag-comply? Yun po ba ang ibig sabihin ng explanation mo?

307
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:29,220
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag sa AOM po, tsaka notice of suspension, yes, binibigyan po silang ng opportunity para mag-comply. Pero kapag ND na po kasi, pag notice of disallowance, ang tangi remedy na lang nila is to settle the amount or to appeal with the commission proper.

308
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:44,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Let us go now to the issue of the Office of the Vice President. Earlier, you said AOMs were issued to the Office of the Vice President. Correct? Now,

309
01:00:44,020 --> 01:00:44,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: specifically,

310
01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:51,240
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: let us go now to the first and second quarter of 2023.

311
01:00:53,920 --> 01:00:59,640
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Showing to you, and if shown to you, and flashed on the screen, would you be able to identify the same?

312
01:01:14,550 --> 01:01:15,710
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

313
01:01:16,060 --> 01:01:32,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, for purposes of identification, this again is a stipulated common exhibit. This AOM, dated February 1, 2024, corresponding to the first and second quarters, have

314
01:01:35,090 --> 01:01:42,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: been identified as Exhibit P-1-12-E for the prosecution.

315
01:01:43,540 --> 01:01:52,420
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor. And a part of the defense, this was pre-marked as D-1-105-OVP for the information of the Honorable Court.

316
01:01:52,580 --> 01:01:54,500
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Attorney Caponan, may proceed.

317
01:01:54,840 --> 01:02:04,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Please look at this AOM and refresh your memory. What, Mr. Witness, did you observe from this AOM?

318
01:02:06,150 --> 01:02:17,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung findings po or observations namin, una po, Hindi po nagsubmit ng documentary evidence of payments si OBP for the first and second quarters of 2023.

319
01:02:20,170 --> 01:02:35,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pangalawa po, based on their accomplishment report, meron kasing nakalagay as payment of rewards, pero wala pong sinubmit si OBP na any document evidencing the success po, which is in violation of the item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular.

320
01:02:36,390 --> 01:02:50,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, for the better appreciation, Your Honor, and with your permission, this is being Flashed on the screen, the findings made are in boxed in red. So yung second finding mo, una, ulitin natin.

321
01:02:51,130 --> 01:02:58,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung una po ay walang sinubmit na documentary evidence of payment si OBP for the first and second quarter of 2023.

322
01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:01,480
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano pa?

323
01:03:02,630 --> 01:03:23,530
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pangalawa po, dahil may line item for the payment of rewards sa kanilang accomplishment report. Wala po silang sinamit na any document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer in violation po noong item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular.

324
01:03:24,050 --> 01:03:40,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron mga, before you go to your next observation, Mr. Witness, meron mga amounts stated dyan. For the record, can you read these amounts and what periods they correspond to? In terms of payment of rewards.

325
01:03:41,120 --> 01:03:57,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this AOM po, yung 15 million pesos ay binayad as payment of reward noong February 6 to March 29, 2023. At yung 12 million pesos naman po ay binayad as reward noong April 25 to June 30, 2023.

326
01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:16,390
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And nakalagay dito, nakalagay, non-compliant with item 4.8 from item 4.8.5.b of the Joint Circular. Why is this non-compliant based on your submissions in your AOM?

327
01:04:17,310 --> 01:04:36,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung item 4.8.5.b po kasi, yun yung documentary evidence o yung document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities. Pero since wala po silang sinamit na document na yun, hindi po nag-comply yung kanilang payment of rewards doon sa requirements ng Joint Circular.

328
01:04:36,810 --> 01:04:51,610
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Para maintindihan natin, kasi medyo technical to, ano yung evidence of success? Ano ang kinoconsider ng office mo na evidence of success?

329
01:04:52,230 --> 01:05:11,370
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Actually, based dun po sa Joint Circular, walang any specific document na na-mention. Pero kasi ang tinitignan po namin is dapat merong causal link yung... surveillance, yung successful surveillance activity or information gathering at saka yung information given by the informer.

330
01:05:11,590 --> 01:05:22,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi ba confidential itong information na rinirequiring? Confidential ba ito? Yung tinatawag mo na causal. Cause at saka effect.

331
01:05:22,710 --> 01:05:23,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

332
01:05:23,970 --> 01:05:27,460
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi ba yan? Is that confidential information?

333
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:33,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Since yun po yung requirement ng Joint Circular, kailangan po nilang i-comply po.

334
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:45,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Necessary ba ang... Ano ang... I will refine. Next question, Mr. Witness. There is a box here in paragraph 3. What is this all about?

335
01:05:49,770 --> 01:05:51,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: What box po? The one

336
01:05:51,970 --> 01:05:52,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: being shown?

337
01:05:55,190 --> 01:06:09,390
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano ang nakalagay dito, nakalagay sa paragraph 3 that the amount with reference to medicine and food aid? Please look at your notes.

338
01:06:11,350 --> 01:06:13,450
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And tell us the significance of these findings.

339
01:06:14,310 --> 01:06:28,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang nakalagay po dito sa number 3 na merong items for the provision of medical and food aid at payment of incentives for traveling relative to the confidential operations ng agency doon sa kanilang first and second quarter accomplishment reports.

340
01:06:29,510 --> 01:06:32,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron mga amounts indicated dito. Pakibasa.

341
01:06:32,990 --> 01:06:39,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. For the accomplishment report for the period February 6 to March 29, 2023,

342
01:06:42,370 --> 01:06:43,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Magkano ito?

343
01:06:44,960 --> 01:07:00,720
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa provision of medical and food aid po, ang nagasos nila ay 42 million pesos. Tapos sa accomplishment report for the April 25 to June 30, 2023, yung nagasos po nila for the provision of medical and food aid ay 40 million pesos po.

344
01:07:02,110 --> 01:07:11,780
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So ang total nito, Mr. Witness, para sa period na to ay 42 million plus 40 million.

345
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:12,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

346
01:07:12,900 --> 01:07:15,350
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 82. Million, Mr. Witness.

347
01:07:15,610 --> 01:07:17,190
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submission po, yes ma'am.

348
01:07:17,250 --> 01:07:32,370
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on their submissions, did they also attach to their submissions any documents showing or proving payments for medical supplies or food supplies?

349
01:07:32,830 --> 01:07:33,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

350
01:07:34,820 --> 01:07:39,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Again, meron pang ibang figures dito, pakibasa, and what are they for?

351
01:07:42,600 --> 01:08:03,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung isa naman po, yung February 6 to March 29 period, 10 million po yung binayad for the payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations. At for the period naman po na April 25 to June 30, 2023, may binayad po na another 10 million for the payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations.

352
01:08:04,280 --> 01:08:08,260
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So sa binasa mo, ang total nito ay 20 million?

353
01:08:08,660 --> 01:08:09,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

354
01:08:09,640 --> 01:08:22,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At itong 20 million ba may kasamang mga resibo or attachments? para patunayan na nagastos tong 20 million para sa travel.

355
01:08:24,370 --> 01:08:28,090
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, wala pong inattach si OBP.

356
01:08:28,430 --> 01:08:37,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. And sa last sentence, ano itong amount na 20 million pesos?

357
01:08:38,270 --> 01:08:46,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ayan po yung total po nung kanilang payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations for the first and second quarter po.

358
01:08:46,580 --> 01:08:50,360
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Ngayon, meron kang conclusion sa last paragraph.

359
01:08:53,300 --> 01:08:54,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can you read it?

360
01:08:55,500 --> 01:09:11,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The provision of medical and food aid and payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations expenses do not fall among those enumerated under item 4.8 of the Joint Circular. Thus, the same should not be charged against the confidential fund of the agency.

361
01:09:11,980 --> 01:09:17,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sinasabi mo ang nature ng listahan sa Joint Circular ay ano?

362
01:09:17,800 --> 01:09:18,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Exclusive po.

363
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:26,370
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Exclusive. Anong ibig sabihin ng exclusive? Bawal ang wala sa listahan. Tama ba yan?

364
01:09:26,570 --> 01:09:27,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

365
01:09:28,770 --> 01:09:41,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Another box item is paragraph number 4. Please refer to your notes as shown on the screen. Anong significance if any nitong finding mo sa AOM?

366
01:09:43,270 --> 01:09:57,380
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under number 4 po, hindi po... naka-indicate sa kanilang physical and financial plan yung specific confidential activities na kanilang paggagamitan po nung kanilang pondo in violation of the item 4.2 of the Joint Circular.

367
01:09:58,160 --> 01:10:05,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Itong physical and financial plan, eh, identified to, stipulated document ito, tama?

368
01:10:08,380 --> 01:10:09,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

369
01:10:09,340 --> 01:10:18,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Ngayon, ano ba dapat pag tinitignan ng isang physical and financial plan? Ano ba ang hinahanap dyan?

370
01:10:19,980 --> 01:10:20,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kasama

371
01:10:20,580 --> 01:10:24,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: ba dyan? Sakop ba niyan ang Christmas party?

372
01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:29,340
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Paulit po ng tanong.

373
01:10:29,700 --> 01:10:33,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasama ba sa physical and financial plan ang Christmas party?

374
01:10:34,420 --> 01:10:38,160
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung agency po ang makakapag-answer niyan. Okay.

375
01:10:38,240 --> 01:10:39,160
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasama ba dyan? Yung

376
01:10:39,160 --> 01:10:43,080
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: physical and financial plan po kasi ginagamit nila to support their allocation. Okay.

377
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:45,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasama ba dyan tree planting?

378
01:10:48,070 --> 01:10:54,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: It is not... It is outside po my authority to... answer that since agency lang po ang makakasagot niya.

379
01:10:54,820 --> 01:11:07,590
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasama ba dyan ang magbibigay ka ng awards? In the nature of your definition of confidential funds, are these activities considered confidential activities?

380
01:11:08,190 --> 01:11:11,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: As an answer, Your Honors, it is beyond the witness authority to determine.

381
01:11:11,650 --> 01:11:19,310
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: If he knows, Your Honor, he's competent. He's a competent witness. He's the one who personally evaluated and he's also a lawyer.

382
01:11:19,370 --> 01:11:22,330
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Witness may answer if he knows. Mr. Ramel, you may answer if you know.

383
01:11:22,670 --> 01:11:31,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: If I am to relate po yung sinabi n'yo dun sa item 4.8 of the Joint Circular, hindi po kasama yung mga binanggit n'yo dun sa allowable expenses po ng Confidential Fund.

384
01:11:33,690 --> 01:11:39,220
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Mr. Rudners. Punta naman tayo sa itong

385
01:11:47,440 --> 01:12:04,260
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: AOM, Audit Observation Memorandum. Ang exhibit number ay, for the record, P-1-12-E. Mr. Counsel, for the respondent. This is a common exhibit.

386
01:12:04,860 --> 01:12:11,340
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Already stipulated and the counterpart exhibit marking by the respondent was already given for the record.

387
01:12:11,980 --> 01:12:16,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: After receiving... Your

388
01:12:20,970 --> 01:12:24,330
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor, may we just clarify if we're referring to the first quarter AOM?

389
01:12:25,310 --> 01:12:32,150
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: She's referring to the respondent's D-1-105-OVP. Thank you, Your Honor.

390
01:12:32,410 --> 01:12:44,280
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, for clarity's sake, the first and second quarters are covered by only one... audit observation memorandum which this witness just testified on.

391
01:12:44,540 --> 01:12:50,960
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes, counsel. The counsel for respondent confirms that. The presiding officer confirms that as well.

392
01:12:51,380 --> 01:13:06,630
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The other liquidation documents, Mr. Witness, were submitted to you for the

393
01:13:08,970 --> 01:13:13,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: office of the Vice President. We now go to the third quarter.

394
01:13:18,030 --> 01:13:18,630
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The

395
01:13:23,870 --> 01:13:26,510
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: findings on liquidation.

396
01:13:37,350 --> 01:13:51,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness. What were your findings? Because this covers the first and second quarter. Ano naman ang findings mo tungkol sa third quarter ng Office of the Vice President?

397
01:13:52,430 --> 01:14:43,280
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa third quarter cash advance and liquidation ng Office of the Vice President, ang naging findings po doon ay una, hindi nagsubmit si Office of the Vice President ng kanilang documentary evidence of payments para sa kanilang third quarter liquidation which is violation po noong item 4.12 of the Joint Circular. Yung kanilang accomplishment report ay merong payment of reward. Pero hindi po siya substantiated ng any document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer, which is in violation of the item 4.8.5b of the Joint Circular. At pangatlo po, Your Honor, may I be allowed to refer to the AOM for the complete

398
01:14:43,280 --> 01:14:45,220
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: enumeration

399
01:14:45,220 --> 01:14:45,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: of the findings?

400
01:14:46,340 --> 01:14:49,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: May the witness refer to his notes to refresh

401
01:14:49,060 --> 01:14:49,460
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: his

402
01:14:49,460 --> 01:14:49,820
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: memory.

403
01:14:50,000 --> 01:14:52,180
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: May we just clarify on this matter?

404
01:14:52,180 --> 01:14:55,420
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes, what is the comment of counsel, correspondent?

405
01:14:55,420 --> 01:15:04,360
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yesterday, I remember that the witness was only in ICFAO until February 2024. Is that correct? May we check the record if that is correct?

406
01:15:05,380 --> 01:15:10,460
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes, 2014 to 2024. That's what he said.

407
01:15:10,900 --> 01:15:22,330
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay, so this AOM for the third quarter was issued August 8, 2024, Your Honor. So he is referring to something that he has no personal knowledge of?

408
01:15:22,630 --> 01:15:27,670
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: What month did you leave Kowa Ikfaw, Mr. Ramil?

409
01:15:28,030 --> 01:15:29,830
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: February of 2024, po.

410
01:15:31,000 --> 01:15:58,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, this is preliminary. We would have, if we were allowed to continue with this questioning, Your Honor. that this witness will attest to the fact that he was the one. Before he left, he drafted. He prepared a draft of an AOM for the third quarter. And if I may be allowed, maybe counsel will see the relationship of my question to this AOM. Then

411
01:15:58,190 --> 01:16:11,270
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: witness, kindly not refer to an AOM. If indeed you prepared a draft, as you will testify on later, you can refer to your notes, but not... My

412
01:16:11,270 --> 01:16:12,470
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: apologies, Your Honor. Do you

413
01:16:12,470 --> 01:16:20,790
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: have notes pertaining to the draft you prepared pertaining to the supposed AOM issued after you left COA Iqfaw?

414
01:16:21,210 --> 01:16:32,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I don't have my notes with me. Pero I can give po yung the additional audit observation based on my draft po na sinamit sa Iqfaw.

415
01:16:32,330 --> 01:16:34,690
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: May we see the draft, Your Honor? Do

416
01:16:34,690 --> 01:16:36,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: you have a copy of the draft,

417
01:16:36,270 --> 01:16:37,950
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Mr. Wamil?

418
01:16:38,130 --> 01:16:42,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I do not have the copy of the draft with me. Nasa file po siya ng ICPAO.

419
01:16:43,390 --> 01:16:47,590
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, attorney kapunan, do you have a copy of the draft? Will you be marking it?

420
01:16:48,170 --> 01:17:07,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: No, Your Honor. We are not marking a draft. We are just eliciting... From this witness' testimonial evidence that before he left, he did prepare a draft which he turned over to his successor in the position, Your Honor. And this will be testified to by our next witness, Your Honor.

421
01:17:07,870 --> 01:17:19,650
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: But witness is not allowed by the court to refer to the AOM issued after he already left the office. If he did not bring his notes, then he cannot refer to any other document while he is testifying.

422
01:17:21,530 --> 01:17:22,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Subject to those

423
01:17:22,270 --> 01:17:23,630
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: conditions, counsel may proceed.

424
01:17:25,390 --> 01:17:52,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, we have finished with the Office of the Vice President for the last quarter of 2022, the first, second, and third quarter, and all the liquidation reports submitted by the respondent Vice President to the COA ICFAO Office, Your Honor. We will now go to the Department of Education.

425
01:17:57,450 --> 01:18:04,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For this, Your Honor, can I ask for a one-minute recess so I can confer? Just one minute, Your Honor.

426
01:18:04,780 --> 01:18:05,300
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: One

427
01:18:06,360 --> 01:18:09,420
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: minute recess is granted. For

428
01:22:05,060 --> 01:22:06,120
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: the panel of prosecutors,

429
01:22:06,540 --> 01:22:07,880
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Attorney Gabunan may proceed.

430
01:22:08,300 --> 01:22:21,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. We now go to the Department of Education. And, Mr. Witness, I will refer you to three quarters. Quarter 1, Quarter 2, and Quarter 3 for 2024.

431
01:22:23,340 --> 01:22:35,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, again, to refresh your memory, what periods do these quarters cover? We are now talking about the Department of Education.

432
01:22:38,790 --> 01:22:47,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions to the ICPAO, yung first quarter po, ang coverage po noon ay February 20 to March 30,

433
01:22:49,570 --> 01:23:00,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 2023. Yung second quarter po ay April 20... to June 29, 2023 at yung third quarter po ay July 12 to September 29, 2023.

434
01:23:01,270 --> 01:23:12,630
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. And the Department of Education, Mr. Witness, please confirm whether or not they submitted documents by way of liquidation for their confidential funds.

435
01:23:13,170 --> 01:23:14,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. They submitted them.

436
01:23:14,410 --> 01:23:20,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And can you refresh your memory? How much did the Department of Education receive?

437
01:23:26,420 --> 01:23:31,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang kanilang confidential fund po for each quarter ay 37.5 million pesos.

438
01:23:33,130 --> 01:23:36,150
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 37.5 million? A fixed amount?

439
01:23:36,730 --> 01:23:38,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. Per quarter.

440
01:23:38,470 --> 01:23:40,830
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And were these amounts withdrawn in full?

441
01:23:41,500 --> 01:23:42,760
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. Based

442
01:23:42,760 --> 01:23:43,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: on the

443
01:23:43,040 --> 01:23:45,480
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: documents po na binigay nila sa amin.

444
01:23:46,150 --> 01:23:52,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Let us now go to these documents that you said were submitted to your office. Who submitted this?

445
01:23:52,600 --> 01:23:54,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The Department of Education.

446
01:23:55,650 --> 01:24:12,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, if you are shown one of these documents, which is a physical financial plan for the first to the third quarter of 2023, furiously marked as exhibits P-1-18-A-3,

447
01:24:15,390 --> 01:24:34,560
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 1-18-A-B and P-1-14-B. For easy reference, Your Honor, this document stipulated and common exhibit also with the defense, Your Honor, is being shown to the witness and flashed on the screen.

448
01:24:34,960 --> 01:24:35,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Correct, Your Honor.

449
01:24:35,950 --> 01:24:38,720
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: On the part of the respondent?

450
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:57,682
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: On the part of the respondent, these are Exhibits D-1-2-DE, D-1-50-DE, and D-1-74-DE.

451
01:24:58,700 --> 01:25:01,580
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Seventy-four, not seventy-nine.

452
01:25:01,681 --> 01:25:02,660
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Seventy-four, Your Honors.

453
01:25:03,030 --> 01:25:06,760
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Okay. Counsel may proceed.

454
01:25:07,460 --> 01:25:14,340
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Witness, these documents that you're seeing now, there is an annotation approved by

455
01:25:15,980 --> 01:25:17,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What does approved by mean?

456
01:25:19,180 --> 01:25:26,140
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang ibig sabihin po ng approved by ay in-approve po nung signatory dito sa box na ito yung contents of the physical and financial plan.

457
01:25:29,650 --> 01:25:32,430
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And this is in all three documents, Mr. Witness?

458
01:25:34,790 --> 01:25:35,690
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, ma'am.

459
01:25:36,430 --> 01:25:44,510
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: There appears to be a signature in these three documents. Whose signature are these?

460
01:25:44,746 --> 01:25:48,256
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Assisting counsel for both parties may approach the witness and compare the documents they possess.

461
01:25:49,970 --> 01:25:54,130
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Please go over these documents and tell us whose signature is this?

462
01:26:00,460 --> 01:26:02,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Signature po ni Vice President Sara Duterte po.

463
01:26:05,650 --> 01:26:10,910
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And you're familiar with this signature for the same reason she stated, Mr. Witness?

464
01:26:11,530 --> 01:26:12,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

465
01:26:13,140 --> 01:26:18,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What does a signature of the Secretary, and

466
01:26:21,610 --> 01:26:33,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: here it is the signature of the Vice President, concurrently Secretary of Education, Sara Duterte. What does this signature attest to?

467
01:26:35,980 --> 01:26:44,020
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang karulat po nung nasabi ko kanina, yung signature niya po rito, ang ibig sabihin ay in-approve niya po yung contents nung physical and financial plan.

468
01:26:46,160 --> 01:26:58,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: I am showing to you now, Mr. Witness, a document which is for the third quarter of 2023.

469
01:27:20,550 --> 01:27:33,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And this is part, as we can see on the screen, this is a part of Exhibit P-1-14-B. Please, for the record, tell

470
01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:39,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: us your observations for

471
01:27:41,320 --> 01:27:54,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the third quarter, for the first, second, and third quarter as appearing in this exhibit and in the notes or the documents you are looking at.

472
01:27:58,480 --> 01:28:00,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: That is here. Can you read?

473
01:28:02,580 --> 01:28:05,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Physical target. Can you read the first column?

474
01:28:05,730 --> 01:28:06,170
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your

475
01:28:06,170 --> 01:28:06,330
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor,

476
01:28:06,570 --> 01:28:23,890
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: this is a quick interjection, again with the due indulgence and I think the patience of opposing counsel, but if we're talking about the third quarter physical and financial plan, I just wanted to confirm that you were still there when you received these documents, correct?

477
01:28:24,350 --> 01:28:24,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

478
01:28:24,990 --> 01:28:25,370
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, okay.

479
01:28:25,490 --> 01:28:26,530
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That's all. It

480
01:28:26,530 --> 01:28:27,850
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: was submitted July 3,

481
01:28:27,990 --> 01:28:29,750
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: 2023. Yes, I just wanted to confirm that.

482
01:28:30,400 --> 01:28:34,520
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Counsel for the panel of prosecutors, attorney Kapunan, you may proceed.

483
01:28:35,970 --> 01:28:49,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What observations have you made or did you make as regards the first quarter submission in the physical and financial plan of the DepEd?

484
01:28:50,140 --> 01:29:00,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Doon sa kanilang physical and financial plan for the first quarter, hindi po naka-indicate yung kanilang specific. confidential activities na pagbabasayan po ng kanilang disbursement from the confidential fund.

485
01:29:01,920 --> 01:29:20,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nakalagay sa first column, counterinsurgency programs. Did the DepEd submit any evidence on this or documents evidencing what it claims to be expenditures on counterinsurgency programs?

486
01:29:21,890 --> 01:29:25,210
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, wala po silang silamit na document.

487
01:29:28,910 --> 01:29:36,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And it says here, what was the outcome expected from this? If you can read for the record.

488
01:29:37,220 --> 01:29:48,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, for the counterinsurgency program, ang expected outcome po ay to prevent any recruitment by the NPA and other communists and left these groups towards teachers and students.

489
01:29:50,640 --> 01:30:06,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And, Mr. Witness, with this submission, did the DepEd, Department of Education, submit? Any list of NPAs, communist or leftist groups?

490
01:30:07,340 --> 01:30:10,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submissions po, wala naman po silang siramit.

491
01:30:11,110 --> 01:30:25,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And the next column, a target to eliminate or reduce recruitment of teachers and learners by communist or leftist groups. Any observation on this?

492
01:30:27,330 --> 01:30:41,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Since hindi po naka-enumerate yung kanilang specific confidential activities, hindi po naka-match yung kanilang physical target on the specific confidential activities na paggagamitan nila ng kanilang fund from confidential. There

493
01:30:41,450 --> 01:30:55,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: was no list of teachers, no list of learners, nor list of communist or leftist groups appended to any of the documents submitted by the DepEd, Mr. Witness.

494
01:30:56,030 --> 01:30:56,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

495
01:30:56,930 --> 01:30:59,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For emphasis, please read the amount here.

496
01:31:02,380 --> 01:31:05,920
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The amount po is 9,375,000 pesos.

497
01:31:06,320 --> 01:31:14,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We go as well to the second quarter.

498
01:31:16,770 --> 01:31:21,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What observations can you make about the second quarter, Mr. Witness?

499
01:31:25,610 --> 01:31:38,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Same po with the first quarter, hindi rin po naka-indicate yung kanilang specific confidential activities na kanilang paggagamitan ng Magiging basis po ng kanilang disbursements from the confidential fund.

500
01:31:38,600 --> 01:31:43,640
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Same observation for the third quarter in terms of physical target. Mr. Witness?

501
01:31:44,040 --> 01:31:44,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

502
01:31:44,760 --> 01:32:07,590
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And the amount, please state for the record. For the second quarter, to eliminate, reduce recruitment of teachers and learners by communist groups or leftist groups. A function of the DepEd. How much was spent by the DepEd for this function?

503
01:32:08,230 --> 01:32:11,490
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the second quarter po, 9.3 million pesos po.

504
01:32:11,630 --> 01:32:13,170
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And for the third quarter?

505
01:32:14,720 --> 01:32:17,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the third quarter, 9.2 million pesos po.

506
01:32:18,420 --> 01:32:19,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

507
01:32:20,090 --> 01:33:14,110
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Again, we go now to the second program or activity allegedly conducted by the DepEd. abuse prevention and control within schools. Mr. Witness, were any documents submitted to show what activities these programs allegedly to prevent abuse and control within schools with the expected objective of reducing abuses against learners did the DepEd? submit any documents as to list of schools or list of learners or list of or number of abuses. Based on

508
01:33:14,110 --> 01:33:16,490
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: their submission po, wala po silang sinubmit na document.

509
01:33:19,470 --> 01:33:30,610
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And the third column says, increase community participation in reporting cases against learners. You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

510
01:33:31,900 --> 01:33:32,670
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

511
01:33:32,670 --> 01:33:32,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And

512
01:33:32,940 --> 01:33:38,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the same is true for the second quarter and the third quarter, Mr. Witness?

513
01:33:39,220 --> 01:33:40,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, yes, ma'am.

514
01:33:40,900 --> 01:33:41,980
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. How

515
01:33:41,980 --> 01:33:48,970
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: much was spent on this activity to increase community participation for the first quarter?

516
01:33:49,510 --> 01:33:52,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the first quarter po, 10 million pesos. And

517
01:33:52,910 --> 01:33:54,010
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the second quarter?

518
01:33:54,350 --> 01:33:58,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the second quarter, 10 million 75 thousand pesos po.

519
01:33:58,250 --> 01:34:00,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And for the third quarter, Mr. Witness?

520
01:34:00,710 --> 01:34:03,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 10,125,000 pesos po. And

521
01:34:03,350 --> 01:34:24,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: for this community participation, totaling for the three quarters, 30 million. Meron bang listahan ng mga communities kung saan na-increase ang participation nila para sa reporting ng abuses ng mga kabataan? May listahan ba na sinubmit ang DepEd dito?

522
01:34:24,940 --> 01:34:26,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang sinubmit na listahan.

523
01:34:27,380 --> 01:34:29,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Para sa tatlong quarters, Mr. Witness.

524
01:34:30,590 --> 01:34:31,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

525
01:34:31,210 --> 01:34:34,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Punti naman tayo dito sa number 3.

526
01:34:36,660 --> 01:34:49,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nakalagay dito, anti-illegal activities, operations. Anong meron bang listahan na binigay ang DepEd? Kung ano-ano itong anti-illegal activities, operations?

527
01:34:51,410 --> 01:34:54,850
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submission po, wala po silang binigay na listahan.

528
01:34:56,040 --> 01:35:03,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Itong nakalagay na illegal activities within schools, may listahan ba ng skwelahan? na binigay?

529
01:35:06,300 --> 01:35:08,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang binigay na listahan.

530
01:35:08,560 --> 01:35:17,100
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: May linagay ba na ano-ano ang tinatawag ng DepEd na illegal activities?

531
01:35:21,060 --> 01:35:22,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pwedeng paulit po ng tanong.

532
01:35:22,780 --> 01:35:34,560
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yung mga activities na sinabi dito sa exhibit, may listahan ba kung ano yung illegal activities na gustong eliminate ng DepEd?

533
01:35:34,820 --> 01:35:36,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang binigay na listahan.

534
01:35:37,060 --> 01:35:56,070
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa third column, nakalagay, increase and heightened conduct of surveillance activities to prevent illegal activities. Again, Mr. Witness, may listahan ba or document ang sinubmit ng DepEd para patunayan na ginastos nga ito?

535
01:35:56,830 --> 01:35:58,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang sinubmit.

536
01:35:58,750 --> 01:36:05,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And your observation is likewise the same, Mr. Witness, for the second and third quarters?

537
01:36:08,730 --> 01:36:11,710
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Walang submission na binigay.

538
01:36:11,770 --> 01:36:12,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

539
01:36:13,330 --> 01:36:17,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pakibasa ang amounts involved dito. For the first quarter, ang amount ay?

540
01:36:19,300 --> 01:36:20,960
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Anong item po, ma'am? Number 3?

541
01:36:21,160 --> 01:36:30,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Number 3, yung tinatawag na anti-illegal activities, operations. Magkano? Kanong ginastos ng DepEd?

542
01:36:30,490 --> 01:36:40,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the first quarter po, 9 million pesos. For the second quarter, 9.1 million pesos. And for the third quarter, 9,140,000 pesos po.

543
01:36:40,670 --> 01:36:45,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano ang arithmetic nun? 9 times... Almost 30

544
01:36:45,720 --> 01:36:46,740
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: million. 27

545
01:36:46,740 --> 01:36:48,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: ,240

546
01:36:48,320 --> 01:36:49,340
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ,000 pesos po.

547
01:36:49,520 --> 01:37:04,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 27 million na wala namang kasamang document para sabihin kung ano yung mga... illegal activities na yan. Lastly, Mr. Witness, anti-extremism at terrorism programs.

548
01:37:06,900 --> 01:37:19,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Extremism and terrorism programs ng DepEd? Anong ibig sabihin nito? Nakalagay dito sa second column. Pakibasa. Your Honor, we'll object to

549
01:37:19,860 --> 01:37:28,840
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: the question, anong ibig sabihin? Because obviously this is something submitted by the DepEd and the witness is not competent enough to testify what DepEd meant.

550
01:37:29,660 --> 01:37:33,580
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, I was just reading it. In fact, there is no question on what is this.

551
01:37:34,000 --> 01:37:37,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Then I apologize for that. I just heard, anong ibig sabihin?

552
01:37:37,980 --> 01:37:39,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We need rope na yun, counsel.

553
01:37:41,710 --> 01:37:51,250
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa second column, gather information necessary for the implementation of general peace and order. Peace and order within the department.

554
01:37:56,100 --> 01:37:59,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron bang sinubmit na documents dito, Mr. Witness?

555
01:38:01,730 --> 01:38:03,410
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Anong document po ulit yan, Ma'am?

556
01:38:03,730 --> 01:38:19,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Itong nakalagay dito, to gather information necessary for the implementation of general peace and order within The department. Tama bang basa ko? Hindi within the country. Within their own department.

557
01:38:20,980 --> 01:38:30,570
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What documents were submitted to evidence this information gathered?

558
01:38:31,600 --> 01:38:33,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang sinamit na document.

559
01:38:34,500 --> 01:39:18,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Last please. Intensify. Next column. Intensify background investigation of DepEd personnel and learners involved. terrorist groups sa campus, involved in terrorist groups. Mr. Witness, any evidence of this intensification? Pinatibay daw ang background information kasi daw merong terrorist groups sa mga skwelahan. Ano naman ang dokumentong sinubmit ng DepEd para patunayan? Natunay nga na may terrorist ang mga eskwelahan. Meron ba? Submit the documents?

560
01:39:18,610 --> 01:39:19,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang sinubmit.

561
01:39:20,210 --> 01:39:25,710
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And this is the same for the second quarter and the third quarter. You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

562
01:39:26,660 --> 01:39:27,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

563
01:39:27,480 --> 01:39:31,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the record, what are the amounts spent allegedly?

564
01:39:33,490 --> 01:39:42,430
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Magkano'ng ginastos ng DepEd para mawalan ng terrorist ang mga eskwelahan? 9 million, correct?

565
01:39:44,980 --> 01:39:47,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the first quarter, can you read?

566
01:39:47,360 --> 01:39:54,060
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents submitted po, for the counterinsurgency program, 9,375,000 pesos po.

567
01:39:54,430 --> 01:39:56,010
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the second quarter?

568
01:39:56,330 --> 01:39:58,690
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the second quarter, 9.3 million pesos.

569
01:39:59,270 --> 01:40:01,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And for the third quarter?

570
01:40:01,570 --> 01:40:03,330
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 9.2 million pesos po.

571
01:40:03,590 --> 01:40:07,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And, pakibasa. Basahin mong lahat.

572
01:40:08,590 --> 01:40:11,170
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the number two, yung abuse prevention.

573
01:40:11,170 --> 01:40:14,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Total. I'm sorry. Sa second quarter, nasabi mo na?

574
01:40:16,560 --> 01:40:18,380
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you clarify your question po?

575
01:40:19,150 --> 01:40:25,410
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the first quarter, sinabi mo, 9,125,000. Second quarter, magkano?

576
01:40:25,730 --> 01:40:26,370
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 9

577
01:40:26,370 --> 01:40:26,830
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: .3

578
01:40:26,830 --> 01:40:27,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: million pesos po.

579
01:40:28,050 --> 01:40:29,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And for the third quarter?

580
01:40:29,730 --> 01:40:31,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 9.2 million pesos.

581
01:40:31,590 --> 01:40:38,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang total, anong significance nito? Pag in-addition mo lahat,

582
01:40:40,270 --> 01:40:52,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: First quarter, second quarter, third quarter, at lahat ng activities na sinabi dito na wala naman dokumento, aba, 37 million pumatak per quarter. You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

583
01:40:53,110 --> 01:40:56,830
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the document po, yung total po ay 37.5 million pesos.

584
01:40:57,090 --> 01:40:57,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: A fixed amount.

585
01:40:57,990 --> 01:40:58,870
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Per quarter. A

586
01:40:58,870 --> 01:41:02,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: fixed amount for the first quarter, 37.5, Mr. Witness?

587
01:41:03,030 --> 01:41:04,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, yes, ma'am.

588
01:41:04,810 --> 01:41:07,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Another fixed amount for the second quarter?

589
01:41:07,960 --> 01:41:09,960
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, yes, ma'am.

590
01:41:10,230 --> 01:41:12,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Another fixed amount for the third quarter.

591
01:41:13,030 --> 01:41:15,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, yes po.

592
01:41:15,890 --> 01:41:22,250
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sina naman ang pirmirma dito? Again, Mr. Witness, na nakalagay approved by?

593
01:41:24,510 --> 01:41:27,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang nakapirma po dito ay si Vice President Sara Duterte po.

594
01:41:28,250 --> 01:41:29,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And that is her signature?

595
01:41:30,290 --> 01:41:31,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes ma'am.

596
01:41:31,230 --> 01:41:34,730
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Which you are familiar with for the same reason you said earlier.

597
01:41:35,190 --> 01:41:35,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes ma'am.

598
01:41:36,690 --> 01:41:40,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We now go to three liquidation documents.

599
01:41:42,540 --> 01:42:46,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: which are land bank checks. Again, stipulated to by this by the counsel for the respondent. These are land bank checks number 00000453 dated February 20, 2023. Exhibit P-1-20-A. Another land bank check, 000000964, dated April 19, 2023. And another land bank check, number 0000002250, dated 11 July, 2023. Marked by prosecution, respectively, as Exhibit P-1-20-A. P-1-20-B and P-1-20-C being flashed on the screen and shown by Atty. Peña to the witness. For

600
01:42:46,720 --> 01:42:51,740
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: the record, counsel, respondent, these are your exhibits. What again for the record?

601
01:42:52,140 --> 01:43:07,310
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: For the check ending 0453 dated February 20, 2023, Your Honors, that was marked as exhibit D-1- For the check dated July 11,

602
01:43:09,030 --> 01:43:33,390
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: 2023, check ending number 2250, that is exhibit D-1-57-DE. And for the other check ending 0964, dated April 19, I believe, 2023, this is D-1-27-DE, Your Honor.

603
01:43:33,430 --> 01:43:35,450
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Correct. Duly noted. Counsel may proceed.

604
01:43:35,790 --> 01:43:47,770
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Thank you, Your Honor. Now, tell us, Mr. Witness, ano naman ang significance ditong mga tatlong land bank checks na nakalagay dito sa screen at na-examine mo?

605
01:43:48,850 --> 01:43:55,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang significance po nung land bank checks na ito ay ito po yung proof na pwede nilang i-withdraw yung kanilang cash advances po.

606
01:43:56,330 --> 01:43:58,010
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And anong periods covered?

607
01:44:01,910 --> 01:44:19,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents po na na-mention, na pakita earlier, for the first quarter, ang period covered po ay February 20 to March, may I refer po to the documents for the period po, Your Honor.

608
01:44:20,420 --> 01:44:29,010
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Witness may do so with respect to the, you're referring to the physical and financial plan. I'm

609
01:44:29,010 --> 01:44:31,370
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: to the ano po. Or

610
01:44:31,370 --> 01:44:33,270
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: to the check. Not the

611
01:44:33,270 --> 01:44:35,310
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: check. To the land bank checks, Your Honor.

612
01:44:49,010 --> 01:44:53,150
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: No, the question, counsel, is for what period does it cover? It's not in the check.

613
01:44:54,510 --> 01:44:58,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What periods do these three checks cover?

614
01:44:58,250 --> 01:45:03,060
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po. For the first quarter, po, since wala

615
01:45:04,920 --> 01:45:21,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: pong nakalagay dito sa checks na period covered, po, ma'am. Pero yung first check, po, is for the first quarter 2023. Yung next check, po, is for the second quarter 2023 and for the yung third check, po, is for the third quarter of 2023.

616
01:45:22,640 --> 01:46:01,120
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We now go to the next set of liquidation documents. And you will be shown disbursement voucher dated January 31, 2023, disbursement voucher dated April 19, 2023, and disbursement voucher dated 11 July 2023, successively marked as Exhibit P-1-19A. Exhibit P-1-19B and Exhibit P-1-19C for the prosecution stipulated exhibits, Your Honor, with

617
01:46:02,820 --> 01:46:03,360
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the defense.

618
01:46:06,040 --> 01:46:06,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Thank you, Your Honor.

619
01:46:06,960 --> 01:46:08,200
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: On the part of the respondent?

620
01:46:08,200 --> 01:46:24,480
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: On the part of the respondent, it is Exhibit D-1-5-DE, Exhibit D-1-29-DE. And the last one, Your Honor, is Exhibit D-1-58-DE.

621
01:46:26,640 --> 01:46:28,800
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Attorney Gabonan, may proceed.

622
01:46:29,710 --> 01:46:39,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, for what periods were these disbursement vouchers given for?

623
01:46:41,270 --> 01:46:52,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these disbursement vouchers po, yung una po ay for the first quarter of 2023. Yung pangalawa ay second quarter of 2023 at yung pangatlo po, hindi

624
01:46:56,330 --> 01:46:58,290
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po nakalagay kung anong specific quarter po.

625
01:46:59,440 --> 01:47:15,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, Mr. Witness, you have gone over this document and it's being flashed on the screen for easy reference of the impeachment court. Any observations that you may have with regards to these three disbursement vouchers?

626
01:47:17,650 --> 01:47:33,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Itong disbursement vouchers po na ito ay in-approve. Ni Undersecretary Annalyn M. Sevilla in violation po noong Joint Circular na ang nakalagay po ay the head of the agency shall be responsible for the approval of the cash advances.

627
01:47:33,330 --> 01:47:34,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sine naman tong pumirma?

628
01:47:35,880 --> 01:47:40,380
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these disbursement vouchers po si Undersecretary Annalyn M. Sevilla.

629
01:47:40,760 --> 01:47:42,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Again, why is this a violation?

630
01:47:43,500 --> 01:47:50,240
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Dahil under the Joint Circular po, it is the responsibility of the head of the agency to approve the cash advances.

631
01:47:52,140 --> 01:47:54,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And who is the head of the DepEd?

632
01:47:55,810 --> 01:48:03,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The head po of DepEd during the period covered by these cash advances po ay si Vice President Sara Duterte.

633
01:48:03,410 --> 01:48:03,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

634
01:48:05,400 --> 01:48:11,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: There appears a signature in each of these three documents.

635
01:48:13,870 --> 01:48:18,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Who? Whose signature are these, if you know?

636
01:48:18,950 --> 01:48:21,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ito po ay mga pirma ni Vice President Sara Duterte.

637
01:48:22,630 --> 01:48:34,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And... Significantly, Mr. Witness, it says here, Vice President of the Philippines and Secretary of Education. You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

638
01:48:37,260 --> 01:48:39,660
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document, yes, ma'am.

639
01:48:39,860 --> 01:48:55,140
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the first quarter. The second quarter also is above the inscription, Vice President of the Philippines and Secretary of Department of Education. You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

640
01:48:55,990 --> 01:48:56,670
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

641
01:48:56,730 --> 01:48:59,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And for the third quarter, it is signed.

642
01:49:00,620 --> 01:49:13,840
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Signature which you identified is above the annotation, Vice President and Secretary of the Department of Education. Mr. Witness, confirming this?

643
01:49:15,960 --> 01:49:16,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

644
01:49:20,520 --> 01:49:33,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And what is the significance, Mr. Witness, of the Vice President? concurrently DepEd secretaries. Signature to these three documents.

645
01:49:35,810 --> 01:49:46,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sinertify po ni Vice President Sara Duterte as the Secretary of Education na yung cash advances po ay kailangan na ayon sa batas at incurred po under her direct supervision.

646
01:49:48,650 --> 01:50:07,640
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can you read from your copy? And it's flashing the screen. Yung particulars nito, above For the first document, above the signature of the Vice President, concurrently Secretary of Education. Pakibasa kasi.

647
01:50:07,980 --> 01:50:09,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: What particular box po?

648
01:50:09,800 --> 01:50:13,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasi, the first, this first document.

649
01:50:14,310 --> 01:50:15,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: What particular box po?

650
01:50:16,230 --> 01:50:24,670
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The one that says particulars and is above. Pakibasa kasi ang dilim, hindi ko makita.

651
01:50:26,152 --> 01:50:50,215
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Particulars: first quarter CY 2023 cash advance payment of allotments under the maintenance and other operating expenses authorized under page 376 of RA No. 11936, the General Appropriations Act, fiscal year 2023, and Section 85, page 778, of the General Provisions, FY 2023.

652
01:50:50,410 --> 01:50:53,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Itong binasa mo ng particulars, ito ba ay

653
01:50:55,780 --> 01:50:56,980
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Confidential funds?

654
01:50:58,310 --> 01:50:58,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Or

655
01:50:58,910 --> 01:51:02,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: relating to confidential funds, yung certification na to?

656
01:51:03,110 --> 01:51:08,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po naka-indicate dito na yung kanilang disbursement ay for the confidential fund of the debit.

657
01:51:10,470 --> 01:51:12,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kung alam mo, what is it for?

658
01:51:13,690 --> 01:51:18,430
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, ang nakalagay ay payment of allotments under the MOOE.

659
01:51:19,080 --> 01:51:39,220
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anong ibig sabihin ng MOOE? Anong ibig sabihin nun? Kung hindi ito confidential funds, ano naman itong MOOE na pinaggamitan ng pera na confidential funds ng Vice President kum Secretary of Education?

660
01:51:39,880 --> 01:51:44,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung MOOE po kasi kasama yun doon sa kanilang regular funds.

661
01:51:45,570 --> 01:51:46,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Regular funds?

662
01:51:47,170 --> 01:51:47,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

663
01:51:49,980 --> 01:52:04,250
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang regular funds ba, pakiexplain lang sa akin from a layman's point of view. Ano ang regular funds at ano ang confidential funds?

664
01:52:05,410 --> 01:52:21,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung regular funds po ng agency, yun yung kanilang pondo na ginagamit nila for their operations. Operations and yun po. Well, yung confidential fund po, ito po yung specific lump sum ng agency which is to be used for their confidential operations.

665
01:52:22,390 --> 01:52:47,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At pareho rin ang annotation dito? sa second disbursement voucher at third disbursement voucher, Mr. Witness, na ito ay patunay na dinisberse ang mga pondo para sa confidential funds para sa operational expenses.

666
01:52:49,330 --> 01:52:51,090
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pwede pong paulit po ng tanong?

667
01:52:51,370 --> 01:53:18,160
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So ang sinasabi ko, I will reform. So itong disbursement voucher, na nakalagay dito, sinabi mo, when asked, you explain that this appears to be, ito nakalagay dito, ay liquidation ng expenses na hindi naman para sa liquidation ng confidential funds. Kasi confidential to ng regular funds niya, tama?

668
01:53:18,400 --> 01:53:23,000
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ah, disbursement voucher pa lang po ito. Disbursement voucher pa lang po itong document.

669
01:53:23,000 --> 01:53:35,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Disbursement voucher, I'm sorry, disbursement voucher. na sinasubmit para liquidating document para sa confidential fund? Mr. Witness?

670
01:53:36,120 --> 01:53:39,740
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: It is one of the documents submitted to support the liquidation.

671
01:53:39,820 --> 01:53:43,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At you confirm na nakalagay dito operational expenses?

672
01:53:45,080 --> 01:53:48,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents, maintenance and other operating expenses.

673
01:53:48,700 --> 01:54:22,010
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Maintenance and other operational expenses. Yung maintenance and other operational expenses ba ay? nasa listahan kung ano ang allowed sa Joint Circular na expenses para sa confidential funds, maintenance, and other expenses. Kasama ba yan sa tinatawag mong exclusive listahan ng puwede paggamitan ng confidential funds, Mr. Witness?

674
01:54:22,470 --> 01:54:30,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pag sinabing maintenance and other operating expenses po, wala po siya specifically dun sa enumeration nung item 4.8.

675
01:54:30,290 --> 01:54:37,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sinabi mo, exclusive. Pag wala sa listahan, bawal. Tama, Mr. Witness?

676
01:54:38,820 --> 01:54:40,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under 4.8 po.

677
01:54:41,320 --> 01:54:48,160
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Under 4.8 of the circular. The same observations, Mr. Witness, for the second and third quarter.

678
01:54:50,140 --> 01:55:06,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang nakalagay dito ay regular funds, maintenance, and M-O-O-E. Hindi confidential funds. Based on your documents, for the second and third quarter, Mr. Witness.

679
01:55:06,690 --> 01:55:10,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents, nakalagay po MOOE. And not confidential funds.

680
01:55:12,310 --> 01:55:22,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Punta naman tayo sa next set of documents, Mr. Witness. Mr. Witness, want to drink water?

681
01:55:22,870 --> 01:55:23,630
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Okay lang po.

682
01:55:23,790 --> 01:55:27,550
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pinom ka ng tubig. Baka pagod ko na. Pero konti na lang.

683
01:55:29,990 --> 01:56:05,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Punta naman tayo sa next set of documents. Ito naman ay Liquidation Report dated March 31, 2023, Liquidation Report dated June 30, 2023, and Liquidation Report dated September 29, 2023. Exhibits P-1-18-A, Exhibit P-1-18-B, and Exhibit P-1-18-B. dash C, respectively, common stipulated document with the defense, Your Honor.

684
01:56:06,080 --> 01:56:07,860
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: For the respondent? For

685
01:56:07,860 --> 01:56:08,560
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: the respondent.

686
01:56:08,600 --> 01:56:09,480
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the respondent.

687
01:56:09,740 --> 01:56:26,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Respectively? Respectively, it is D-1-2-DE. Next would be D-1-26-DE. And the third one would be D-1-55-DE, Your Honor. Correct.

688
01:56:26,180 --> 01:56:28,140
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Counsel, please proceed.

689
01:56:28,700 --> 01:56:37,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, please look at your document again at pakibasa yung particulars.

690
01:56:38,420 --> 01:56:39,180
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa

691
01:56:39,180 --> 01:56:45,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: first liquidation report, anong period cover dito?

692
01:56:46,510 --> 01:56:52,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this liquidation report po, February 20, 2023 to March 30, 2023.

693
01:56:52,650 --> 01:57:06,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At anong nakalagay dito? First quarter nakalagay and it says here particulars again. Madilim. Pag-ibasa itong nakalagay under the column particulars.

694
01:57:06,350 --> 01:57:29,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under the column particulars, ang nakalagay po ay to liquidate the cash advance granted for payment of operational MOU expenses of the Vice President, Secretary of Department covered by check number 000000453 dated February 20, 2023 with DV number 2023-02-02987.

695
01:57:29,870 --> 01:57:37,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, sinabi mo M-O-O-E na naman. Maintenance and other operational expenses.

696
01:57:38,640 --> 01:57:48,300
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ito ba ay allowed as liquidation ng confidential funds under your Joint Circular 2015?

697
01:57:49,970 --> 01:57:57,430
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kung M-O-O-E po yung expense, hindi po siya kasama dun sa specific enumeration ng Joint Circular under item 4.8.

698
01:58:00,010 --> 01:58:06,770
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kagaya ng sinabi mo, exclusive ang listahan at bawal ang wala sa listahan. Tama, Mr. Witness?

699
01:58:07,430 --> 01:58:08,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

700
01:58:08,410 --> 01:58:16,120
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The same observation can be made. Second quarter, tama, Mr. Witness, and third quarter.

701
01:58:20,420 --> 01:58:22,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, yes po.

702
01:58:22,840 --> 01:58:26,640
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The second quarter covering what period for the record?

703
01:58:28,420 --> 01:58:34,720
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the second quarter, ang nakalagay po dun sa liquidation report, April to June 30, 2023.

704
01:58:35,410 --> 01:58:37,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And the third quarter, Mr. Witness. Ang

705
01:58:37,890 --> 01:58:41,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: nakalagay po doon sa liquidation report, July to September 30, 2023.

706
01:58:42,030 --> 01:58:59,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At pareho rin nakalagay. Walang reference sa confidential funds. At sinabi mo earlier, itong MOOE, maintenance and other expenses, are dapat kasama sa regular funds, hindi confidential funds, Mr. Witness.

707
01:59:00,490 --> 01:59:01,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, Ma'am.

708
01:59:03,860 --> 01:59:06,580
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron dito sa bottom portion, signature.

709
01:59:10,240 --> 01:59:14,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In all three documents, there is a signature appearing

710
01:59:16,500 --> 01:59:19,340
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: thereat. Pakitingin ang signature na yan.

711
01:59:25,650 --> 01:59:28,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: What particular portion po yung tinutukoy niya, Ma'am?

712
01:59:28,450 --> 01:59:33,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In the bottom portion, Mr. Witness. Flashed on the screen.

713
01:59:36,800 --> 01:59:40,340
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Who certified the document, Mr. Guamil?

714
01:59:40,740 --> 01:59:49,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, sinertify po ni Secretary. and Vice President Sara Duterte yung box B ng liquidation reports.

715
01:59:51,160 --> 01:59:52,600
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: For all three quarters?

716
01:59:56,060 --> 01:59:56,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Your Honor.

717
01:59:57,390 --> 01:59:58,570
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: You may proceed, counsel.

718
02:00:02,260 --> 02:00:11,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What is the significance? Ano ang nakikita mong signature dito? Signature ni Vice President, tama? Sa three quarters?

719
02:00:12,220 --> 02:00:13,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents, yes ma'am.

720
02:00:14,000 --> 02:00:29,200
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on these documents. Ano naman ang significance? Ano ang importance ng nakikita natin na signature ng President, Vice President dito sa tatlong liquidation documents na pinakita mo sa court?

721
02:00:30,570 --> 02:00:38,930
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sinertify po ni Vice President Sara Duterte sa liquidation reports po na ito na yung purpose po nung kanilang cash advance ay na-accomplish ng agency.

722
02:00:41,530 --> 02:00:44,910
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang sinabi mo ay sinertify ng Vice President?

723
02:00:45,330 --> 02:00:47,490
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. Based on this document.

724
02:00:47,730 --> 02:01:10,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on this document, miski nakalagay sa particulars, Mr. Witness, na ang pinaggamitan ng confidential funds are maintenance and... other operational expenses, sinertify ng vice president at naginginami dito sa confidential funds. Yun ba ang ibig sabihin ng signature ng vice president, Mr. Witness?

725
02:01:11,360 --> 02:01:15,240
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on these documents po, yun po yung sinertify ni vice president.

726
02:01:17,080 --> 02:01:26,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We next go, we now go to the next documents, which are accomplishment reports for the three quarters.

727
02:01:28,400 --> 02:01:51,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And we will flash this on the screen showing to you these documents for your memory. Again, Your Honor, these are stipulated documents for the prosecution. This is Exhibit P-1-16A dated March 31, 2023.

728
02:01:55,050 --> 02:02:09,240
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Likewise, Your Honor, we are showing on the screen Another accomplishment report, which is P-1-16B, dated June 30, 2023.

729
02:02:11,720 --> 02:02:26,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And lastly, Your Honors, an accomplishment report dated September 30, 2023. Mark the exhibit P-1-16C.

730
02:02:27,630 --> 02:02:34,870
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: And respectively, these are D-1-21DE, D-1-51DE, and D-175DE for the respondent.

731
02:02:34,930 --> 02:02:36,150
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: We confirm that, Your Honor. Thank you.

732
02:02:36,410 --> 02:02:38,790
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Denied to the records. Counsel, you may proceed.

733
02:02:39,110 --> 02:02:43,590
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What is the significance, Mr. Witness, of these accomplishment reports?

734
02:02:50,770 --> 02:02:52,570
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question, ma'am? Sorry.

735
02:02:57,710 --> 02:03:00,930
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: What's the significance of the accomplishment reports, Mr. Witness?

736
02:03:01,290 --> 02:03:09,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The significance po nung accomplishment report is that dito po nakalagay yung kanilang confidential expenses na pinaggamitan nung kanilang confidential one.

737
02:03:12,800 --> 02:03:17,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And what observations do you have, if

738
02:03:22,280 --> 02:03:22,540
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: any?

739
02:03:23,890 --> 02:03:25,830
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: On what particular period po?

740
02:03:26,700 --> 02:03:33,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Per quarter. The first quarter, anong observation ang masasabi mo dito sa accomplishment report na sinubmit?

741
02:03:35,820 --> 02:04:24,570
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the first quarter po, meron po silang sinama na line item for confidential expenses. Hindi po among the allowable confidential expenses under item 4.8 of the Joint Circular. At yun po yung payment of incentives for traveling relative to the confidential operations under the counterinsurgency program. Also under the abuse prevention and control with schools program. Under the anti-illegal activities operations. and under the anti-extremism terrorism programs. And also, dun sa kanilang anti-extremism or terrorism programs, meron din nakalagay na provision of medical input aid which is not among the allowable expenses under item 4.8 of the Joint Circular.

742
02:04:27,390 --> 02:04:53,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mga magkano, you mentioned here that the actual outcome accomplishments are purchase of information, payment of rewards, purchase of supplies, payment of incentives, traveling related to confidential information. Magkano naman ang amounts involved dito?

743
02:05:00,170 --> 02:05:23,200
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yung payment of information. Prevention of recruitment. Ito, nakalagay dito, actual outcome. Nag-prevent daw sila ng recruitment ng mga NPA at komunista at leftist groups sa skwelahan. Magkano ang bayad daw?

744
02:05:23,580 --> 02:05:45,280
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the purchase of information po, 2,470,000. For the payment of reward, 2 billion pesos. For the purchase of supplies, 2,805,000 pesos. And for the payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations, 2.1 million pesos po. With a total amount po na 9,375,000 pesos.

745
02:05:45,970 --> 02:05:55,250
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Para sa prevention ng recruitment ng NPA ng komunista at ng leftist sa mga eskwelahan, Mr. Witness.

746
02:05:55,650 --> 02:05:57,610
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under this accomplishment report, yes, ma'am.

747
02:05:57,790 --> 02:06:07,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Nagsubmit ma ng dokumento ang DepEd kung ano-anong eskwelahan sila successful.

748
02:06:08,930 --> 02:06:12,610
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on their submission, wala po silang sinubmit na particular schools.

749
02:06:13,470 --> 02:06:29,300
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Dito rin sa column nito nakalagay, Conducted surveillance in 115 areas. May sinubmit ba ang DepEd ng listahan ng 115 areas na ito?

750
02:06:30,220 --> 02:06:31,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po silang sinubmit.

751
02:06:33,030 --> 02:06:56,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At nakalagay dito sa item B. 100% successful daw sila. 100% implementation of activities without untoward security-related incidents. Itong activities na to, na 100% compliance daw. Meron bang listahan na sinubmit ang DepEd para dito?

752
02:06:58,970 --> 02:06:59,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

753
02:07:00,250 --> 02:07:05,470
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Last column, reduce abuses against learners.

754
02:07:06,990 --> 02:07:20,430
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: purchase of information, payment of reward, purchase of supplies, payment of incentives, or traveling. Pakibasa, Mr. Witness, magkano ang total na

755
02:07:22,860 --> 02:07:30,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: binayad allegedly ng DepEd para daw ma-reduce ang abuso sa mga studyante?

756
02:07:31,720 --> 02:07:34,660
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this accomplishment report, 10 million pesos po.

757
02:07:41,960 --> 02:07:45,480
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: I'm sorry. What else did you observe, Mr. Witness?

758
02:07:47,050 --> 02:08:01,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this accomplishment report, meron din po silang payment of reward na 2 million pesos for the counterinsurgency programs, 2,130,000 pesos for the abuse prevention and control within schools,

759
02:08:03,580 --> 02:08:23,890
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 1.5 million pesos for the anti-illegal activities operations, 1,879,000 pesos for the anti-extremism terrorism programs. Pero wala po silang sinamit na document. Evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer.

760
02:08:26,030 --> 02:08:36,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Base sa observation mo at sa mga sinabi mo dito, meron bang violations ito ng Joint Circular 2015?

761
02:08:37,760 --> 02:08:41,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, na-violate po yung item 4.8.5 of the Joint Circular.

762
02:08:42,360 --> 02:08:45,460
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pakiulit nga kung ano yung item 4.8.

763
02:08:45,870 --> 02:09:13,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung item 4.8.5 po, dun nakalagay yung three conditions for a valid payment of reward. Una, it must be approved by the head of the agency. Pangalawa, it must be supported with a document evidencing the success of the information gathering or surveillance activity on the account of the information given by the informer. At pangatlo, ay dapat directly related yung activity to the conduct of the confidential activities of the agency concerned.

764
02:09:18,360 --> 02:09:39,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano naman? Mr. Witness, para sa unang item, prevention of recruitment, etc., 9.3 million. Para sa reduction of abuse against learners, 10 million. Para sa eliminate illegal activities sa loob ng skwelahan,

765
02:09:41,830 --> 02:09:49,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: another 9 million. At para kumuha ng alleged mga information.

766
02:09:51,820 --> 02:10:07,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: para i-implement daw itong mga programs na to, 9.1. At lahat-lahat, iba-iba. Pero ang total na naman ito, basahin mo nga ang total for the period February 20, March 30, 2023.

767
02:10:09,910 --> 02:10:12,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang total po ay 37.5 million pesos.

768
02:10:13,960 --> 02:10:15,100
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Eksakto, Mr. Witness.

769
02:10:17,850 --> 02:10:19,410
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Eksakto po sa cash advance nila.

770
02:10:19,930 --> 02:10:22,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Eksakto sa cash advance nila.

771
02:10:24,620 --> 02:10:29,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa last page dito, and I'll show you now the last page, there is here,

772
02:10:33,170 --> 02:10:35,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: approved by. Anong ibig sabihin?

773
02:10:36,810 --> 02:10:43,550
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang ibig sabihin po ng approved by ay in-approve po nung signatory kung ano man yung contents ng accomplishment report.

774
02:10:43,850 --> 02:10:50,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At tela, sino ang signatory nito ng accomplishment report na to?

775
02:10:51,050 --> 02:10:55,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang signatory po ay si Vice President and Education Secretary, Sara Duterte po.

776
02:11:00,660 --> 02:11:03,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We now go to the next document. Counsel,

777
02:11:04,100 --> 02:11:07,020
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: if I'm not mistaken, that's the second to the last document, correct?

778
02:11:07,240 --> 02:11:07,700
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor.

779
02:11:07,940 --> 02:11:09,660
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The certification and then the AOM.

780
02:11:10,060 --> 02:11:10,700
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor.

781
02:11:11,470 --> 02:11:24,470
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Just so that we can pause for lunch after those two documents so that we don't cut you off in regard to your direct. I presume you will be ending your direct after those two documents are identified by the witness? Your

782
02:11:24,470 --> 02:11:45,050
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor. If I may, just for... for expediency sake, only, of course, if the distinguished opposing counsel would allow. Since these documents are quite similar except for the amounts, we are willing to stipulate that the witness will have the same observations for the second quarter, the third quarter, ang pagkakaiba lang po siguro ay yung amounts.

783
02:11:46,040 --> 02:11:48,600
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: With respect, you're referring to the certification?

784
02:11:49,570 --> 02:11:52,090
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Sorry, the accomplishment reports. I

785
02:11:52,090 --> 02:11:59,550
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: think, so stipulated, no need to proceed with respect to the other two documents. Same observation except for the amounts.

786
02:11:59,850 --> 02:12:03,130
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, without accepting, of course, the interpretation of the witness which goes without

787
02:12:03,130 --> 02:12:11,610
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: saying. Of course. But same testimony with respect to his observation for the second and the third quarter that he gave in regard to the first quarter. If that is okay with the

788
02:12:11,610 --> 02:12:13,790
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: opposing, distinguished opposing counsel.

789
02:12:13,890 --> 02:12:44,200
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor, it is in order and with our counter-manifestation that the testimony of this witness by way of explanation to these accomplishment reports for the second and third quarter be likewise adopted by way of reference and explanation to why these activities are in violation of the Joint Circular 2015, Your Honor.

790
02:12:44,380 --> 02:12:56,430
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Same testimony with respect to the first quarter. Julie noted, counsel may proceed with certifications and I guess the AUM. Again, before we pause for lunch, counsel.

791
02:12:58,570 --> 02:12:59,370
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We

792
02:12:59,370 --> 02:13:16,410
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: now go to three certifications. And this is a DepEd certification dated March 31, 2023. DepEd certification dated June 30, 2023. And DepEd certification dated October 2, 2023.

793
02:13:21,930 --> 02:13:29,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: P-1-15-B and P-1-15-C. And

794
02:13:29,330 --> 02:13:37,530
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: likewise for the respondent, D-1-6-DE, D-1-30-DE and D-1-59-DE. We

795
02:13:37,530 --> 02:13:38,510
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: confirm, Your Honor. Thank you.

796
02:13:38,650 --> 02:13:39,710
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted. Counselor, proceed.

797
02:13:40,750 --> 02:13:58,930
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, it is now our turn to ask if counsel is willing to stipulate as to these DepEd certifications as to the meaning of a test. and as to the signature in these documents being the signature of the Vice President.

798
02:13:59,150 --> 02:14:07,290
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: And that these are pro forma documents or the witness previously did not see anything, did not observe anything extraordinary.

799
02:14:07,890 --> 02:14:20,190
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes. Counter-manifestation that these are templates and that we do not admit the interpretation of what attest means but we do accept that the witness will have the same explanation, his explanation of what attest means.

800
02:14:20,250 --> 02:14:21,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: In regard to it being pro forma. Yes.

801
02:14:23,200 --> 02:14:29,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: If I may, that pro forma to me means copy-paste, Mr. Witness.

802
02:14:29,300 --> 02:14:32,520
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Which I objected to. I hope you understand.

803
02:14:32,845 --> 02:14:35,174
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Akala ko makakalusot. Okay.

804
02:14:36,240 --> 02:14:38,400
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Stipulation duly noted by both parties.

805
02:14:40,740 --> 02:15:10,030
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Lastly, Mr. Witness, after auditing all of these documents you identified and giving your explanations as to why, based on these documents, your evaluation thereat, you stated that they are non-compliant or violation or bawal or irregular compared based on the Joint Circular 2015. What did you do?

806
02:15:10,450 --> 02:15:15,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: The statement was a conclusion, Your Honor.

807
02:15:16,560 --> 02:15:28,620
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The witness earlier stated that he observed certain non-compliant entries in the submissions from the office of the Vice President.

808
02:15:28,820 --> 02:15:29,780
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: We submit, Your Honor. We're

809
02:15:29,780 --> 02:15:32,460
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: going to the AOM already, counsel. Please proceed.

810
02:15:34,200 --> 02:15:49,310
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Having observed what you earlier testified to, discrepancies, irregularities, pagkukulang, mga bawal na submissions, Ano ang ginawa mo after making this evaluation?

811
02:15:50,290 --> 02:15:56,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I drafted po an audit observation memorandum containing po yung findings noted during the audit.

812
02:15:57,040 --> 02:16:01,360
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And you drafted this? Anong nangyari sa draft mo?

813
02:16:02,000 --> 02:16:08,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung 41st and 2nd quarter po ay na-issue po dun sa OVP, ay dun sa DPED po.

814
02:16:09,030 --> 02:16:12,450
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay, I'm now showing to you a certified true copy. Assisting

815
02:16:12,450 --> 02:16:13,270
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: counsels may approach.

816
02:16:14,890 --> 02:16:19,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: audit, observation, memorandum dated February 1, 2024.

817
02:16:21,760 --> 02:16:24,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Being flashed on the screen as well.

818
02:16:41,640 --> 02:16:51,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mark, Your Honor, as prosecutions exhibit P-1-21A, common exhibit with the defense.

819
02:16:51,820 --> 02:16:55,020
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: For the defense, it's D-1-132, correct, counsel?

820
02:16:55,680 --> 02:17:01,880
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: No, Your Honors, it's D-1-111-DE. 111.

821
02:17:04,080 --> 02:17:04,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor.

822
02:17:06,080 --> 02:17:15,680
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Noted. And Mr. Witness, look at your document to refresh your memory. What periods does this Audit Information Memorandum cover?

823
02:17:17,280 --> 02:17:27,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this Audit Observation Memorandum, ang period covered po ay March 20, April 20 to March 30, 2023 at April 20 to June 29, 2023.

824
02:17:28,540 --> 02:17:36,640
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And Mr. Witness, please tell us what your recommendations are. or were, if any.

825
02:17:37,540 --> 02:17:47,280
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: May recommendations po include, first, yung hindi po na-submit ni DepEd yung kanilang documentary evidence of payments for their confidential expenses.

826
02:17:49,780 --> 02:17:51,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano po, Mr. Witness?

827
02:17:51,640 --> 02:18:06,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa accomplishment report po nila, meron pong line items na hindi allowable under the item 4.8 of the Joint Circular at yun po yung Provision of medical input, aid at payment of incentives or traveling relative to the confidential operations of the DepEd.

828
02:18:07,440 --> 02:18:18,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What else, Mr. Witness? And for the appreciation of the Honorable Impeachment Court, this is being flashed on the screen and boxed in red. What else, Mr. Witness?

829
02:18:18,910 --> 02:18:29,710
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung payment of rewards po nila ay hindi supported ng documents evidencing the success of the information gathering and or surveillance activities on account of the information given by the informer.

830
02:18:32,170 --> 02:18:33,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anything else, Mr. Witness?

831
02:18:34,190 --> 02:18:45,950
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Number 4 po, yung kanilang physical and financial plan hindi po naka-indicate yung specific confidential activities na pagbabasayan ng kanilang disbursement in violation of the item 4.2 of the Joint Circular.

832
02:18:51,390 --> 02:18:52,910
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Anything else, Mr. Witness?

833
02:18:53,570 --> 02:19:05,090
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung kanilang disbursement voucher po ay in-approve ni Undersecretary Annalyn M. Sevilla instead of the head of the agency in violation of item 6.3.1b of the Joint Circular.

834
02:19:07,590 --> 02:19:10,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And who is this person that you mentioned?

835
02:19:11,450 --> 02:19:17,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the document submitted, si Annalyn M. Sevilla po yung Undersecretary for Finance ng DepEd

836
02:19:17,010 --> 02:19:17,670
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: during

837
02:19:17,670 --> 02:19:19,610
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: the time po na na-issue tong AOM.

838
02:19:20,010 --> 02:19:21,450
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And the signature?

839
02:19:23,120 --> 02:19:24,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can you identify the signature?

840
02:19:28,100 --> 02:19:30,540
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Signature po, sa'ng part po?

841
02:19:32,560 --> 02:19:34,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: On the last page of this document.

842
02:19:36,390 --> 02:19:37,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Which among these po?

843
02:19:38,030 --> 02:19:39,590
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The AOM, Mr. Witness.

844
02:19:42,440 --> 02:19:46,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Which among these signatures po yung tinutukoy niyo? There

845
02:19:46,580 --> 02:19:56,980
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: is a signature here above the name Assistant Commissioner Officer in Charge, Nilda B. Laras. Can you identify this signature?

846
02:19:57,560 --> 02:19:58,460
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

847
02:19:58,860 --> 02:20:00,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And why?

848
02:20:01,650 --> 02:20:08,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kasi nakita ko po siyang pumirma ng ibang documents at yung signature niya on those documents is the same po with this one.

849
02:20:11,860 --> 02:20:14,160
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: There are signatures as well below.

850
02:20:15,880 --> 02:20:37,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: It says, proof of receipt of AOM, Vice President Sara Z. Duterte, Vice President Edward Fajarda, SDO, the Chief Accountant, the COA ATL DepEd. You confirm? These names and their designations?

851
02:20:39,790 --> 02:20:41,290
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat po, ma'am?

852
02:20:43,600 --> 02:21:03,320
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In the proof of receipt of this AOM, meron mga nakalagay na pangalan na received daw ng Sara Z. Duterte. Pero hindi niya signature to. Merong Gloria Mendoza. Edward Fajarda, the SDO. What does SDO mean, Mr. Witness? The

853
02:21:03,320 --> 02:21:03,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Special

854
02:21:03,500 --> 02:21:06,160
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Dispersing Officer po, based on the Rejoined Circular.

855
02:21:06,360 --> 02:21:17,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Also received by his office, and likewise, the COA, Chief Accountant, and the COA ATL, received this AOM.

856
02:21:18,630 --> 02:21:20,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mr. Witness, you confirm that?

857
02:21:21,660 --> 02:21:24,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nareceive po siya ng mga nakapirma po dito sa signature part po.

858
02:21:24,740 --> 02:21:28,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What happened next, if any, if you know?

859
02:21:30,480 --> 02:21:38,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala na po akong personal knowledge since before po sila magbigay ng response, na-transfer na po ako out of ICFAO to another audit sector of COA.

860
02:21:38,600 --> 02:21:40,160
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And you got transferred when?

861
02:21:40,770 --> 02:21:42,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: On February 12 po of 2024.

862
02:21:43,810 --> 02:21:49,580
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, Mr. Witness, and this is the second to the last question, Mr. Witness,

863
02:21:51,240 --> 02:22:05,300
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Could you tell us, after you did this audit evaluation and these recommendations, what happened next? What other matters occurred, if any, in connection with your audit?

864
02:22:05,910 --> 02:22:06,890
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: From when po?

865
02:22:06,970 --> 02:22:09,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: During the time that you were still there.

866
02:22:11,070 --> 02:22:14,330
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: There was a time po that I was called in a meeting.

867
02:22:14,930 --> 02:22:16,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Tinawag ka sa meeting.

868
02:22:16,500 --> 02:22:17,660
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

869
02:22:17,660 --> 02:22:20,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At nandun ka pa sa COA-ICFA.

870
02:22:20,860 --> 02:22:21,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

871
02:22:21,580 --> 02:22:23,520
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Maalala mo anong date itong meeting na to?

872
02:22:24,780 --> 02:22:29,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: It was around second week po nung September of 2023.

873
02:22:30,520 --> 02:22:33,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sino-sino ang nasa meeting na to?

874
02:22:34,840 --> 02:22:48,060
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang naalala ko po ay si Atty. Zuleika Lopez at si Atty. Michael Powa po. At yung dating head po ng ICFAO na si Assistant Commissioner Nilda Plaras at si Atty. Gloria Camora po.

875
02:22:48,380 --> 02:22:50,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Sinong nagtawag ng meeting na to?

876
02:22:51,910 --> 02:22:57,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi ko na po ma-recall kung sino nagtawag. Ang naalala ko lang po ay pinasama po ako dun sa meeting na yun.

877
02:22:58,450 --> 02:23:01,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pinasama ka? Bakit ka pinasama sa meeting na to?

878
02:23:01,970 --> 02:23:08,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Dahil ako po yung in-charge of the audit of the confidential fund nung DepEd at OVP po.

879
02:23:09,260 --> 02:23:14,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kilala mo ba, Mr. Witness, si Atty. Michael Poa?

880
02:23:16,230 --> 02:23:17,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nakikita ko po siya sa news.

881
02:23:19,950 --> 02:23:24,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nakikita mo siya sa news? Hindi mo siya nakikita sa in-person? Kaya no?

882
02:23:26,110 --> 02:23:30,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: During that time, sorry, hindi po clear yung particular period.

883
02:23:32,110 --> 02:23:38,230
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kilala mo ba? When you went to that meeting, were you able to identify Attorney Michael Powa?

884
02:23:38,810 --> 02:23:39,890
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nagpakilala po sila, ma'am.

885
02:23:40,170 --> 02:23:46,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nagpakilala sa'yo. Okay. And what happened during that meeting? Attorney, sorry for that.

886
02:23:47,150 --> 02:23:47,970
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: No, no, no, that's fine.

887
02:23:48,150 --> 02:23:55,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nagpapagising lang tayo. You confirmed that this is the attorney that you saw in that meeting?

888
02:23:56,470 --> 02:23:57,290
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

889
02:23:57,490 --> 02:24:00,730
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. What happened sa meeting na yan?

890
02:24:01,290 --> 02:24:13,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: They asked po about the liquidation process po ng confidential fund and yung mga supporting documents po na required with respect to the liquidation documents po.

891
02:24:13,150 --> 02:24:20,670
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Sinabi mo, before I go to the next question, sinabi mo na nandun lens si... Atty.

892
02:24:22,430 --> 02:24:23,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Zuleika Lopez.

893
02:24:24,490 --> 02:24:26,240
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa pagkakalala ko po, yes ma'am.

894
02:24:26,240 --> 02:24:26,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Do

895
02:24:26,690 --> 02:24:28,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: you know? Did you know then who she was?

896
02:24:30,270 --> 02:24:33,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nagpakilala po siya sa amin as the Chief of Staff of the OB People.

897
02:24:34,570 --> 02:24:36,030
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Chief of Staff of?

898
02:24:36,510 --> 02:24:38,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: The Office of the Vice President.

899
02:24:38,390 --> 02:24:42,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ano naman ang connection niya, if at all, sa DepEd?

900
02:24:45,820 --> 02:24:49,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po siyang sinabing na connection niya with the DepEd. Okay.

901
02:24:49,760 --> 02:24:57,780
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ngayon naman, Mr. Witness, tell us what transpired, if you recall, of that meeting sometime in September.

902
02:24:59,100 --> 02:25:09,380
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: They asked po about the liquidation process po nung cash advances as well as kung ano po yung mga supporting documents required.

903
02:25:12,400 --> 02:25:18,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And anong sagot? Tinanong nila, again, tinanong nila kung anong mga requirements.

904
02:25:20,620 --> 02:25:21,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi

905
02:25:21,300 --> 02:25:24,200
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: nila alam ang mga requirements para sa...

906
02:25:24,200 --> 02:25:32,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: They clarified po kasi may mga agencies din po na nagka-clarify sa amin about requirements ng Joint Circular since it is very technical po.

907
02:25:33,340 --> 02:25:35,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At ano naman ang sagot ninyo?

908
02:25:35,440 --> 02:25:42,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: They were referred po by Assistant Commissioner Nilda Plaras to the Joint Circular for the specific requirements.

909
02:25:45,340 --> 02:26:05,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And nung sinabi ni... ng COA IGFAO, sinabi ni Assistant Commissioner Nilda Plaras ang requirements. Ano ang reaction nila? Ni Atty. Zuleika at ni Atty. POA. Kung maalala mo.

910
02:26:06,190 --> 02:26:11,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nag-confirm naman kanyang reaction po ni Atty. Zuleika.

911
02:26:11,910 --> 02:26:18,410
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sinabi mo, during the meeting, Mr. Witness, tinanong nila ano ang mga requirements.

912
02:26:20,360 --> 02:26:27,700
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: para mag-submit ng documents para liquidation ng confidential funds. Tama?

913
02:26:27,700 --> 02:26:28,130
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

914
02:26:28,130 --> 02:26:28,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

915
02:26:28,370 --> 02:26:31,830
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sinabi naman, ang sagot eh...

916
02:26:32,470 --> 02:26:44,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: They were referred to the Joint Circular. Joint Circular. And sinabi din po ni Associate Commissioner Nilda Paraclaras na in case merong makitang findings during the audit, ay mag-i-issue po ng AOM.

917
02:26:45,150 --> 02:26:47,710
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Noong sinabi ng...

918
02:26:49,500 --> 02:26:54,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Assistant Commissioner. Eh, basahin nyo na lang yung Joint Circular. Ano naman ang response nila?

919
02:26:55,160 --> 02:27:04,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Well, they ask po if instead of an audit observation memorandum in case may audit findings, ay audit query na lang po yung i-issue sa kanila.

920
02:27:05,440 --> 02:27:22,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Audit query na lang ang dapat i-issue? Yun ba ang sinabi nila? Ano naman itong audit query na sinabi nila, ito na lang please ang i-issue ninyo, huwag na lang AOM? Ano? What is an audit query, Mr. Witness?

921
02:27:22,800 --> 02:27:23,460
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi

922
02:27:23,460 --> 02:27:30,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po ako familiar sa audit query since hindi naman po siya kasama dun sa issue 1 under the Joint Circular 2015-01.

923
02:27:31,650 --> 02:27:36,220
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa Joint Circular, walang audit query?

924
02:27:36,600 --> 02:27:37,040
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

925
02:27:39,820 --> 02:27:47,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ngayon, anong nangyari nung sinabi nilang audit query na lang, please, ang i-issue ninyo?

926
02:27:48,590 --> 02:27:49,230
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi

927
02:27:49,230 --> 02:27:49,930
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: po. Bakit?

928
02:27:51,150 --> 02:27:51,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Anong

929
02:27:51,790 --> 02:27:52,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: nangyari?

930
02:27:54,030 --> 02:28:05,610
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po pumayag si ICFAO since hindi naman po sa sanction nung aming Joint Circular 2015-01. So nag-issue pa rin po kami ng AOM nung may nanote po kaming findings during the audit.

931
02:28:05,990 --> 02:28:13,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. So nag-issue pa rin despite this meeting ng isang AOM. Pagkatapos nun, anong nangyari if you still recall?

932
02:28:14,430 --> 02:28:25,630
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: After po ma-approve yung AOM, nag-attempt po kaming iserve. yung AOM to the office address po nung OBP, pero hindi po siya tinanggap dahil wala lang po mag-receive na authorized person.

933
02:28:26,330 --> 02:28:31,690
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. And, itong first attempt n'yo, pagkatapos nun, anong nangyari?

934
02:28:32,700 --> 02:28:41,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: On the afternoon of the same date po na nag-attempt kami to serve, nagbigay po sila ng revised accomplishment report sa ICFAO.

935
02:28:43,820 --> 02:28:48,730
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Ngayon, Mr. Witness,

936
02:28:51,010 --> 02:28:52,410
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: sinabi mo,

937
02:28:53,930 --> 02:29:05,100
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: kahapon at ngayon na ang basis ng inyong post-audit or compliance audit ay ang Joint Circular.

938
02:29:05,260 --> 02:29:06,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 2015

939
02:29:06,100 --> 02:29:11,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: ng limang government agencies. Kasama dyan ang COA. Tama.

940
02:29:11,760 --> 02:29:12,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: If

941
02:29:12,600 --> 02:29:25,470
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: I show you at babasahin ko, flash on the screen, Section 1 of the Joint Circular. Can we please flash it on the screen?

942
02:29:35,740 --> 02:29:39,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ini-explain dito and please refer. Do you have a copy with you?

943
02:29:41,170 --> 02:29:43,090
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po. I have a copy po with me.

944
02:29:45,350 --> 02:29:47,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: I refer you now to

945
02:29:49,680 --> 02:29:54,820
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the last sentence which says,

946
02:30:00,720 --> 02:30:39,530
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The COA shall promulgate accounting and auditing rules and regulations, including those for the prevention of irregular, unnecessary, excessive, extravagant, or unconscionable expenditures or uses of government funds and property. You confirm, Mr. Witness?

947
02:30:40,050 --> 02:30:42,490
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I'm based on this joint circular, yes ma'am.

948
02:30:42,990 --> 02:30:45,830
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. So, if

949
02:30:47,910 --> 02:30:48,610
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: I ask you,

950
02:30:50,650 --> 02:31:05,360
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: sa mga sinubmit na documents ng Vice President, and I will, for purposes of summarizing, Purchase of information, 14 million.

951
02:31:08,390 --> 02:31:44,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Reward payment, 10,050,000. Rental of safe house, 11 days, nag-rent ang Office of the Vice President ng safe houses from December 21 to 31, 16 million in 11 days. divided by the number of days, 2 million a day ang binayad ng Office of the Vice President para lang sa rental ng safe house. Tama?

952
02:31:45,660 --> 02:31:48,760
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: May I refer po to the document po?

953
02:31:49,490 --> 02:31:57,860
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Refer to the document. It's in front of you. Meron pa rin mga ibang expenses.

954
02:31:59,760 --> 02:32:01,260
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron nakalagay

955
02:32:03,380 --> 02:32:11,510
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa summary, payment of reward, various, 34,857,000.

956
02:32:13,080 --> 02:33:06,150
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron din. Purchase supplies, 11,813,000. Payment of rewards, Mr. Witness, 24 million, 10 million. Payment of rewards, rewards in medicine, in kind. 24,930,000, Mr. Witness. Payment of rental of transport vehicles related, allegedly, to confidential activities, 10 million pesos. Tables and chairs, 500,000 pesos. Desktop computers and printers, 3 million pesos. pesos.

957
02:33:08,760 --> 02:33:10,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: You confirm that, Mr. Witness?

958
02:33:14,080 --> 02:33:16,540
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pwede pong paulit ng enumeration kasi I don't

959
02:33:16,540 --> 02:33:18,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: have preference. Ito ay nasa notice of

960
02:33:18,380 --> 02:33:19,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: suspension

961
02:33:19,260 --> 02:33:25,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: and your tabulation.

962
02:33:26,560 --> 02:33:27,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Okay, ma'am.

963
02:33:27,800 --> 02:33:30,220
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Do you confirm, Mr. Wamil?

964
02:33:30,220 --> 02:33:31,640
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Yes, Your Honor, po.

965
02:33:32,330 --> 02:33:36,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Based on Section 1 of

966
02:33:41,120 --> 02:33:50,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the Joint Circular. I-translate ko na lang. Anong ibig sabihin n'yo?

967
02:33:52,570 --> 02:33:56,170
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Irregular. I'm sorry. This is my last question.

968
02:34:03,390 --> 02:34:16,520
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Medyo limited ang aking Tagalog o Pilipino. Ang pagkaintindi ko sa irregular e kaduda-duda. Tama? Kaduda-duda. Irregular.

969
02:34:19,070 --> 02:34:34,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang counsel for respondent, if you can help me, it's in this translation. Happily welcome your translation. Unnecessary sa Pilipino. Unnecessary, hindi kailangan.

970
02:34:35,110 --> 02:34:37,930
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Irregular is hindi palagi, hindi kinagawian.

971
02:34:39,550 --> 02:34:41,090
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Hindi pangkaraniwan.

972
02:34:42,330 --> 02:34:44,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Irregular. Counsel, correspondent,

973
02:34:45,130 --> 02:34:46,250
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: do you agree? Hindi pangkaraniwan?

974
02:34:46,250 --> 02:34:47,250
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Your Honor, I do.

975
02:34:51,970 --> 02:34:58,710
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kasi ang nalaman lang natin the other day is unusual. Ngayon naman, irregular.

976
02:35:01,510 --> 02:35:01,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi.

977
02:35:02,020 --> 02:35:03,280
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Hindi pangkaraniwan.

978
02:35:03,460 --> 02:35:10,260
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi pangkaraniwan. Unnecessary. Hindi kailangan.

979
02:35:10,740 --> 02:35:16,220
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, I would all do respect again if you may just ask the question na lang po. Sandali.

980
02:35:17,040 --> 02:35:19,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Preliminary, Your Honor. Preliminary. Because this

981
02:35:19,020 --> 02:35:20,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: is already, I

982
02:35:22,140 --> 02:35:22,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: think we all

983
02:35:22,900 --> 02:35:24,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: know what's happening here.

984
02:35:25,240 --> 02:35:33,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In any event, Your Honor, give me some leeway here. This is the last question before we break up for lunch and considering the

985
02:35:33,080 --> 02:35:34,180
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: victory

986
02:35:34,180 --> 02:35:37,480
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: of Ayala, Your Honor. We're all in a happy mood.

987
02:35:37,760 --> 02:35:47,300
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Let council wind up with our direct council correspondent. Let's give her some leeway. Let's help in translating more accurately.

988
02:35:50,700 --> 02:35:52,080
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Unnecessary, hindi kailangan.

989
02:35:54,760 --> 02:35:56,780
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Excessive, labis, labis.

990
02:35:59,400 --> 02:35:59,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Extravagan,

991
02:36:02,900 --> 02:36:03,580
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Maluho.

992
02:36:04,160 --> 02:36:06,960
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: E ang nakalagay dito, bongga kaday.

993
02:36:08,580 --> 02:36:28,820
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ekstravagant. Bongga. Ekstravagant. At lastly, unconscionable. Sabi ng Atty. Virgil, kasuklam-suklam. Unconscionable. Okay, Mr. Witness, sa binasa natin, Section 1, saan, if at all, itong mga binasa ko,

994
02:36:30,920 --> 02:36:32,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: saan babagsak?

995
02:36:34,270 --> 02:36:36,630
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Objection, Your Honor. Question calls for a conclusion.

996
02:36:37,670 --> 02:36:38,210
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In

997
02:36:38,210 --> 02:36:45,630
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: relation to his observation only, not as to the conclusion of law, given that the AUM is not a final disposition of

998
02:36:45,630 --> 02:36:52,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the matter at hand. In relation to your observation and based on the audited documents, will

999
02:36:54,640 --> 02:36:57,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: it fall, if any, under any of this enumeration?

1000
02:36:58,610 --> 02:37:02,320
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am. Under the irregular expenditures.

1001
02:37:03,610 --> 02:37:04,150
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Irregular.

1002
02:37:06,590 --> 02:37:26,330
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Irregular po siya dahil hindi po siya compliant or hindi po siya compliant with the provisions of the Joint Circular 2015-01 which is an issuance po of the COA, the DBM, the DILG, the GOCC, GCG, and the Department of National Education, National Defense rather.

1003
02:37:26,590 --> 02:37:28,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay, and my last question to you, Mr. Witness.

1004
02:37:30,530 --> 02:37:51,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Let us go now to paragraph 8.3. of the Joint Circular. And this is being flashed on the screen for the record and for better appreciation of this honorable court. Please read paragraph 8.3.

1005
02:37:53,850 --> 02:38:09,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under item 8.3, failure of the accountable officer to liquidate any public funds for which he is accountable upon demand by any duly authorized officer shall be prima facie evidence that he has put such missing funds or property to personal use and benefit.

1006
02:38:10,300 --> 02:38:22,100
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So nakalagay dito sa 8.3, you are a lawyer as well, Mr. Witness, apart from an auditor. Ano ang ibig sabihin dito ng prima facie evidence?

1007
02:38:24,190 --> 02:38:35,730
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang ibig sabihin po ng prima facie evidence under 8.3 ay nagkaroon po ng presumasyon na ginamit yung funds for the personal use and benefit of the accountable officers.

1008
02:38:36,270 --> 02:38:49,550
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So kung ang accountable officer at masasabi mo ba ng Vice President and concurrently Secretary of Education, masasabi mo ba na accountable officer ito?

1009
02:38:50,600 --> 02:39:24,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the Joint Circular po, yes po, kasi under the Joint Circular, it shall be the responsibilities of the head of agency to oversee the agency-wide use of the confidential fund and to ensure compliance with the requirements of the Joint Circular. And also, in attest po ni Vice President, in her capacity as the Vice President of the Philippines and the Secretary of the DepEd, yung certification ng accountable officers na ginamit yung Pond of Order confidential expenses.

1010
02:39:25,200 --> 02:39:25,480
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

1011
02:39:25,700 --> 02:39:33,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ngayon, ang confidential fund, sa binasa mo, ang confidential fund ba ay public fund?

1012
02:39:33,780 --> 02:39:34,660
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1013
02:39:38,200 --> 02:39:54,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yung post-audit mo naman na sinabi mo ay Irregular. May discrepancies. Ito ba ang inaudit mo ay liquidation documents ng Vice President?

1014
02:39:55,040 --> 02:39:59,280
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 44th quarter of 2022 until 3rd quarter of 2023 po. Yes, ma'am.

1015
02:39:59,460 --> 02:40:17,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sinabi mo based on 8.3 na merong funds na hindi ma-account o walang dokumento na sinamit ang Vice President. Tama. At ang DepEd. Tama.

1016
02:40:18,040 --> 02:40:19,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pwedeng paulit po ng question.

1017
02:40:19,740 --> 02:40:37,930
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sinabi mo yesterday at ngayong araw na merong mga pondo na hindi naman confidential funds, ginamit sa confidential funds. Or sinabing ginamit sa confidential funds pero wala naman dokumento. Objection,

1018
02:40:37,930 --> 02:40:40,730
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor. Misleading as to dun sa sinabi na wala naman.

1019
02:40:40,730 --> 02:40:41,850
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Sustained, counsel. Kindly reform.

1020
02:40:42,050 --> 02:41:03,680
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. So you said here, that if an accountable officer, pag hindi na-explain ng isang accountable officer ang paggamit ng public funds, kagaya ng confidential funds, meron tinatawag na prima facie evidence. Anong tawag doon? Presumption?

1021
02:41:04,000 --> 02:41:04,640
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Presumption.

1022
02:41:05,120 --> 02:41:06,120
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Presumption ng ano?

1023
02:41:06,890 --> 02:41:12,530
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under 8.3 po, presumption na yung fund po ay na-convert into personal use or benefit.

1024
02:41:13,510 --> 02:41:21,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: presumption na na-convert for personal use or benefit, applicable dito sa sinabi mo.

1025
02:41:22,310 --> 02:41:24,510
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Conclusion of law, Your Honor. Calls for a conclusion.

1026
02:41:25,030 --> 02:41:26,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, that is... Your Honor,

1027
02:41:27,010 --> 02:41:29,110
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: all these matters are pending still. Sustained.

1028
02:41:30,170 --> 02:41:38,990
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please. Ang tawag ko nang doon. hindi prima facie evidence. Kung akong tatanungin, scam ito.

1029
02:41:39,010 --> 02:41:42,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Move to strike, Your Honor. Move to strike. That is out of order, Your Honor. No

1030
02:41:42,650 --> 02:41:43,770
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: further questions, Your Honor.

1031
02:41:43,930 --> 02:41:44,230
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Move

1032
02:41:44,230 --> 02:41:44,850
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: to strike.

1033
02:41:45,010 --> 02:41:49,330
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: So stricken from the record, no further questions. Direct examination is completed.

1034
02:41:51,770 --> 02:42:05,530
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel for respondent, Tony Poa, we shall have your cross after we resume for a brief lunch break. We shall resume at 1.15. for our lunch break.

1035
02:42:05,690 --> 02:42:06,290
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor.

1036
02:42:06,370 --> 02:42:07,670
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Trial is in recess.

1037
03:26:01,200 --> 03:26:02,720
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Hereby resumed.

1038
03:26:04,070 --> 03:26:11,630
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Mr. Wamil, we shall continue with your testimony and you shall be testifying under the same oath. You understand, sir?

1039
03:26:13,650 --> 03:26:14,750
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kindly respond through the mic.

1040
03:26:15,090 --> 03:26:15,870
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Okay, po, Your Honor.

1041
03:26:16,860 --> 03:26:23,380
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: We shall now proceed with the cross-examination of the counsel for respondent. Atty. Powa, you may proceed when you're ready.

1042
03:26:23,760 --> 03:26:25,060
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor. Thank you.

1043
03:26:26,780 --> 03:26:28,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Mr. Wamil, good afternoon, po, sir.

1044
03:26:28,900 --> 03:26:29,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Good afternoon, po, sir.

1045
03:26:29,980 --> 03:26:38,160
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Sa pagkaalala ko po, nabanggit niya po, that you were formerly with ICFAO as a state auditor. Tama po ba?

1046
03:26:38,160 --> 03:26:39,020
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1047
03:26:39,020 --> 03:26:42,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And you are a certified public accountant. Tama po ba?

1048
03:26:42,850 --> 03:26:43,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

1049
03:26:43,260 --> 03:26:43,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: sir.

1050
03:26:43,540 --> 03:26:45,250
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: You're also a lawyer, correct?

1051
03:26:45,250 --> 03:26:46,160
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1052
03:26:46,160 --> 03:26:48,800
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: You passed the bar in 2022?

1053
03:26:48,800 --> 03:26:50,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: 2023 po.

1054
03:26:50,400 --> 03:27:04,570
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ah, 2023. Okay, I stand corrected. And Mr. Wamil, you also testified yesterday during your direct examination that you were part of the team. that audited the OBP and DepEd confidential funds. Is that correct?

1055
03:27:05,210 --> 03:27:08,470
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po, Tim, kasi ako lang po yung nag-evaluate ng documents.

1056
03:27:09,110 --> 03:27:12,810
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ah, ikaw mismo, basically, nag-evaluate ng documents. Tama po ba?

1057
03:27:12,810 --> 03:27:13,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes

1058
03:27:13,270 --> 03:27:13,550
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po, sir.

1059
03:27:13,670 --> 03:27:26,840
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay, just so maintindihan lang namin how ICPAU conducts its audit. Yung mga auditors po ba, do they go to the field and observe itong mga confidential operations in person?

1060
03:27:27,360 --> 03:27:33,540
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Since what we do po is compliance audit, we base our audit on the documents being submitted to the ICFAO.

1061
03:27:33,660 --> 03:27:41,550
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And do you get special training as auditors pagdating sa how confidential or intelligence operations are conducted?

1062
03:27:41,550 --> 03:27:41,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: We

1063
03:27:41,860 --> 03:27:46,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: base po our observations on the provisions naman po ng Joint Circular 2015-01.

1064
03:27:49,290 --> 03:27:57,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Basically, what you're saying is you base your audit on the documents submitted to you, not just by DepEd or OVP, but by any other government agency. Ganyan sa ICPAU.

1065
03:27:58,010 --> 03:28:05,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents if they are compliant with the requirements of the Joint Circular 2015-01. Correct. Thank you. So,

1066
03:28:05,010 --> 03:28:14,550
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: pagdating po dun sa mga dokumento na tatanggap n'yo from OVP and DepEd, binabasa n'yo po ito isa-isa, no? Lahat ng attachments?

1067
03:28:15,090 --> 03:28:16,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po ako yung nag-receive

1068
03:28:16,750 --> 03:28:18,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: noon. Meron po kaming receiving staff po.

1069
03:28:18,520 --> 03:28:22,630
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Pero kayo po, in your evaluation, do you go through the documents one by one?

1070
03:28:23,010 --> 03:28:27,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po. I evaluate po if they are compliant with the requirements of the Joint Circular. Okay.

1071
03:28:28,050 --> 03:28:41,600
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, when you evaluated these documents, nakita niyo po ba doon kung sino ang nag-approve ng grant ng confidential funds for OVP for the fourth quarter of 2022?

1072
03:28:41,600 --> 03:28:43,120
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nakita ko po doon

1073
03:28:43,120 --> 03:28:46,760
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: sa distribution voucher po. na si Asek, Linuel G. Ortonio po.

1074
03:28:46,920 --> 03:29:01,260
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: No, I mean the grant. Kasi wala po sa gaah yung OVP Confidential Funds for 2022 eh. So nakita niyo po ba kung sino ang nag-approve nung grant para sa fourth quarter 2022 Confidential Funds?

1075
03:29:01,280 --> 03:29:07,860
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents submitted, si Office of the President po yung nag-approve. That's correct. Opo, Office of the President.

1076
03:29:07,940 --> 03:29:26,130
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Pagdating naman po sa OVP 2023 Confidential Funds, Yun po ay nasa General Appropriations Act. Do you confirm that? Yes po. And pagdating naman po sa DepEd, 2023 Confidential Funds, nasa General Appropriations Act din po. Tama po ba?

1077
03:29:26,690 --> 03:29:27,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1078
03:29:27,430 --> 03:29:33,010
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And as a lawyer, you would know that the GAA is enacted by Congress. Tama po ba?

1079
03:29:33,270 --> 03:29:33,890
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: That's correct.

1080
03:29:34,130 --> 03:29:54,910
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now yesterday, naalala ko po, natanong kayo, doon sa time nyo sa ICFAO, kung ilang vice president ang na-audit n'yo pagdating sa confidential funds. Alala n'yo po yun? Yes po, sir. At ang sagot n'yo po ay isa lang si vice president Sara Duterte, the respondent in this case. Tama po ba? Yes po. Since

1081
03:29:54,910 --> 03:29:56,530
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I assumed in ICPAO in 2014.

1082
03:29:57,090 --> 03:29:59,700
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Since you assumed in September 2014?

1083
03:29:59,700 --> 03:30:00,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po sir.

1084
03:30:00,510 --> 03:30:07,380
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po. And you were asked bakit si vice president lang? Naalala nyo yung tanong na yun?

1085
03:30:07,380 --> 03:30:07,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1086
03:30:07,780 --> 03:30:16,350
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At ang sagot nyo po kasi since you assume siya lang po ang vice president na nagkaroon ng appropriations for confidential funds. Tama po ba?

1087
03:30:16,590 --> 03:30:20,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po. Since September 2014 po lang nag-assume ako. Apo.

1088
03:30:20,610 --> 03:30:24,550
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now I'm showing you a document. If I may approach the witness, Your Honor.

1089
03:30:24,690 --> 03:30:25,410
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel may approach.

1090
03:30:28,750 --> 03:30:35,050
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I am showing you a document entitled... I am

1091
03:30:35,460 --> 03:30:36,900
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: showing

1092
03:30:36,900 --> 03:30:53,080
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: you a document and this document is from the Department of Budget and Management entitled Special Allotment Release Order Dated. Medyo malabo lang po yung document. December 22, 2014.

1093
03:30:55,660 --> 03:30:56,800
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Nakita niyo po yan.

1094
03:30:57,020 --> 03:31:06,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: At ang purpose po... is to cover confidential activities for fiscal year 2014.

1095
03:31:07,340 --> 03:31:15,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Do you see that? Yes, sir. And noong December 22, 2014, nasa ICFAO na po kayo. Tama po ba?

1096
03:31:18,540 --> 03:31:19,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Anong period po yan, sir?

1097
03:31:22,870 --> 03:31:26,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: We have a clear here po. Date of issue, December 22, 2014.

1098
03:31:28,180 --> 03:31:29,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, nasa ICFAO na po.

1099
03:31:29,480 --> 03:31:30,020
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po ba?

1100
03:31:30,260 --> 03:31:30,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: At

1101
03:31:30,700 --> 03:31:35,360
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: hindi po si Vice President Sara Duterte ang Vice President ng mga panahon na yun. Tama po ba?

1102
03:31:35,360 --> 03:31:36,160
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1103
03:31:36,160 --> 03:31:52,870
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Pero na-liquidate po ba yan? That's the question. That's the question to IGPOW actually because yun po yung ang pinapakita ko lang sa inyo is nagkaroon po ng confidential funds. Ang Office of the Vice President noong 2014 issued. December 22, 2014.

1104
03:31:54,390 --> 03:31:57,250
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on that document po. Meron. You

1105
03:31:57,250 --> 03:32:11,860
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: confirm. But that's okay, no? Because maybe you were just not aware yesterday when you were asked the question. I just wanted to put that on record because marami na rin pong lumalabas sa social media na si Vice President Sara Duterte lang ang Vice President na nagkaroon ng

1106
03:32:11,860 --> 03:32:14,460
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: confidential funds. But you confirmed that, sir.

1107
03:32:15,190 --> 03:32:42,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honors, just a manifestation, this has not been pre-marked. We just came upon this document yesterday after the statements were made. So upon the agreement made during pre-trial, We request that this be marked as exhibit for the defense D-1-167-DE, sorry, dash OVP. Let it be so, Mark. Thank you, Your Honor.

1108
03:32:43,370 --> 03:32:44,550
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Provisional only, Your Honor.

1109
03:32:45,090 --> 03:32:49,710
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, of course, subject to the objections of the prosecution when the time is appropriate.

1110
03:32:50,050 --> 03:32:50,610
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Of course, at the proper time.

1111
03:32:51,870 --> 03:32:54,990
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor. And we will provide the prosecution with a copy as well.

1112
03:32:56,410 --> 03:32:56,890
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: kindly

1113
03:32:56,890 --> 03:32:57,110
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: do

1114
03:32:57,110 --> 03:33:10,930
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: that after, perhaps later on, after the trial, or now too, so that it can be made a subject matter of redirect to the counsel for the panel of prosecutors. I can give you

1115
03:33:10,930 --> 03:33:12,270
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: just a

1116
03:33:12,270 --> 03:33:19,690
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: photo. We would like to manifest that this is just a printout, Your Honor, and a photocopy that we retrieved from the office of the Vice President.

1117
03:33:20,070 --> 03:33:20,550
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted.

1118
03:33:26,130 --> 03:33:26,610
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ito,

1119
03:33:26,630 --> 03:33:27,470
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: bibigyan ba natin ito?

1120
03:33:28,370 --> 03:33:28,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay.

1121
03:33:29,290 --> 03:33:32,690
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Anyway, Mr. Witness, nung pinag

1122
03:33:32,690 --> 03:33:53,570
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: -aaralan ko yung nature ng confidential funds, may mga issuances akong nakita aside from yung JC 2015-01 na parating yung namimention kahapon and today. And that is COA Circular 92-985. Yun po ba ay familiar sa inyo?

1123
03:33:55,600 --> 03:34:15,250
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I can give you a copy. Your Honor, I am giving the witness a copy of a document entitled Commission and Audit, Circular No. 92-385, dated October 21, 1992. For the reference of the court, this was marked as Exhibit D-1-155.

1124
03:34:18,560 --> 03:34:23,220
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Naalala po ba ninyo yung document na yan or familiar po ba kayo sa document na yan?

1125
03:34:26,540 --> 03:34:28,340
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Witnesses perusing the document, Your Honors?

1126
03:34:28,980 --> 03:34:29,420
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted.

1127
03:34:33,920 --> 03:34:37,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: If Assistant Counsel would like to also from the prosecution?

1128
03:34:46,420 --> 03:34:47,680
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Witness will please answer.

1129
03:34:48,600 --> 03:34:50,060
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Are you familiar with that

1130
03:34:50,060 --> 03:34:50,400
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: document?

1131
03:34:51,260 --> 03:34:53,520
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I am not familiar po with that document. Okay.

1132
03:34:53,760 --> 03:34:54,460
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That's okay.

1133
03:34:57,080 --> 03:35:08,060
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Meron lang po ditong whereas clauses. I won't ask you about the entire document anyway. Meron lang po ditong whereas clauses on the first page. Can you see that? Mr. Witness?

1134
03:35:09,330 --> 03:35:09,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Whereas

1135
03:35:09,850 --> 03:35:10,210
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: clauses.

1136
03:35:11,830 --> 03:35:16,320
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I would just want you to read the fourth whereas clause.

1137
03:35:17,970 --> 03:35:28,050
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ito pa. Ma'am, you want to come here so you'd have a better view. Just the fourth whereas clause. Can you please read that out loud for the record?

1138
03:35:30,950 --> 03:35:33,290
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Atty. Kapunan, it's also flashed on the screen.

1139
03:35:34,720 --> 03:35:49,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Whereas, these intelligence and confidential activities by their very nature are highly sensitive and confidential operations or missions, details of which cannot be divulged without posing a threat to national security or to the success of the mission. Can

1140
03:35:49,300 --> 03:35:51,400
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: you please read the next whereas as well? Thank you.

1141
03:35:52,160 --> 03:36:16,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: As now being required, the submission of receipts, bills or commercial invoices in support of disbursements from this fund or rental of safe houses, purchase of meals or supplies, and other expenses may create a leak of information that may threaten the confidentiality of the intelligence operations, endanger the lives and the safety of the agents and employees of the government agencies, and result to a failure of the mission.

1142
03:36:16,820 --> 03:36:20,540
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And just the next two whereas clauses na lang po para hindi na po tayo humaba.

1143
03:36:20,840 --> 03:36:40,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Whereas in many instances, it is impractical and sometimes impossible to obtain such receipts, bills, or commercial invoices during intelligence operations. Whereas by its very nature, the use of intelligence and or confidential plans requires an approach allowing more flexibility in intelligence operations.

1144
03:36:41,480 --> 03:36:42,600
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Mr. Witness.

1145
03:36:43,060 --> 03:37:31,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: In manifestation, Your Honor, first of all, this exhibit presented by counsel for the respondent. is dated October 1, 1992, Your Honor, whereas the joint circular cited as basis by this witness, Your Honor, is dated 2015, Your Honor. There is no indication here. Okay. There is an indication here, Your Honor, that all issuances in consistency with are hereby... amended or revoked accordingly. Similar provision, Your Honor, by way of manifestation,

1146
03:37:32,000 --> 03:37:33,480
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: is

1147
03:37:35,180 --> 03:37:56,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: likewise in, is likewise, Your Honor, mentioned in the Joint Circular 2015, observation for the record that 2015 supersedes this circular cited by counsel for respondent which is dated 1992, Your Honor, for the record.

1148
03:37:56,730 --> 03:37:57,210
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted.

1149
03:37:58,490 --> 03:38:16,610
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor. But again, we'd like just a counter-manifestation that the repealing clause under JC 2015-01 states, and I quote, all circulars, memoranda, rules, regulations, and other issuance inconsistent herewith are deemed repealed and superseded accordingly.

1150
03:38:17,010 --> 03:38:26,390
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: So the repealing clause in 201.5-1 did not specify COA circular 92-8985. Precisely our point, Your Honor.

1151
03:38:26,530 --> 03:38:27,930
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please counter manifestation.

1152
03:38:28,510 --> 03:38:29,090
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Of course, Your Honor.

1153
03:38:29,750 --> 03:38:55,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Counsel read the literal meaning, Your Honor, but the substantive meaning is all circulars, all circulars are deemed repealed and superseded accordingly. His interpretation, my interpretation, but no interpretation needed, Your Honor. 9.0 is expressed, all. are repealed and superseded accordingly.

1154
03:38:56,890 --> 03:38:58,470
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Manifestation as Duly noted. Your

1155
03:38:58,470 --> 03:39:07,530
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor, the documents would speak for themselves and we will leave this to the Honorable Court as to not prolong the debate on this matter.

1156
03:39:08,270 --> 03:39:19,250
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Just again, just my last manifestation on this. The difference between Joint Circular 2015, Your Honor, it has been

1157
03:39:23,420 --> 03:40:05,940
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: identified, authenticated, and testified to by this witness. This circular that they are citing, Your Honor, 1992, has not been identified. We don't know its due existence. We don't know the circumstances surrounding this document. And therefore, they're covered by the original document rule. Produce the original, since you don't have a witness who has testified. as to its existence, due execution, and least of all, its content, Your Honor. And we are stating that this should be clearly in the records of this proceeding, Your Honor.

1158
03:40:06,160 --> 03:40:17,220
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Noted without prejudice to respondent presenting during their evidence-in-chief the original copy of the document and someone testifying thereto. We submit, Your Honor. Please proceed, counsel.

1159
03:40:20,140 --> 03:40:36,520
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Doon, base po sa binasa n'yo, Mr. Witness, nakikita natin na mag-iba ang auditing standards or guidelines pagdating sa confidential or intelligence funds kung ikukumpara sa regular funds. Tama po yan?

1160
03:40:36,900 --> 03:40:44,340
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Well, based on the Joint Circular 2015-01, magkaiba po yung treatment between confidential funds and intelligence funds.

1161
03:40:44,460 --> 03:40:56,820
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Opo. At base rin po doon, sa binasa n'yo, Ang kadalasan nangyayari pag resibo o invoices ay maaaring maging impraktikal kung yun ang ire-require. Tama po ba?

1162
03:40:58,740 --> 03:41:04,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under the joint circular po kasi, the auditors may require the... Your

1163
03:41:04,840 --> 03:41:08,000
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor, that's not responsive. I was just asking him to confirm what he read.

1164
03:41:08,340 --> 03:41:09,960
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kindly answer the question, witness.

1165
03:41:10,280 --> 03:41:15,000
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Just on the circular that you read. Circular 92-3. Can you repeat the question,

1166
03:41:15,060 --> 03:41:15,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: sir?

1167
03:41:15,540 --> 03:41:24,770
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ayon po doon. Yung regular requirement na paghihingi ng mga resibo, acknowledgement receipts, may be impractical pagdating po sa confidential operation.

1168
03:41:24,790 --> 03:41:32,770
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Can we ask counsel, Your Honor, to show that particular position that he is citing in respect of the circular?

1169
03:41:33,030 --> 03:41:34,090
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Can we do so, counsel?

1170
03:41:41,710 --> 03:41:51,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Tama po ba? Ang sabi po dito ay during intelligence operations. Yes. Tama po ba? As stated po dito, during intelligence operations. Okay.

1171
03:41:51,390 --> 03:41:53,430
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you. Well, I'll accept that answer, Your Honor.

1172
03:41:57,290 --> 03:42:15,190
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, punta naman po tayo doon sa nature ng confidential operations. You would agree with me na pagdating po sa confidential operations, delikado po pag nagkakaroon ng leak of information. Tama po ba?

1173
03:42:18,100 --> 03:42:25,040
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Delikado po kung magkaroon ng leak ng mga information na nakukuha patay sa isang confidential operation.

1174
03:42:28,390 --> 03:42:28,930
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I think

1175
03:42:28,930 --> 03:42:32,750
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: the witness would have been able to answer. Witness may answer?

1176
03:42:33,810 --> 03:42:37,437
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, [unclear] the classified nature of the confidential fund.

1177
03:42:38,270 --> 03:42:46,970
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: thank you, Mr. Witness. In fact, you being a lawyer, you know that there are laws prohibiting the unauthorized disclosure of confidential information, correct?

1178
03:42:50,170 --> 03:42:52,530
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: You being

1179
03:42:53,070 --> 03:43:00,310
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: a lawyer, sir, you are aware that there are laws prohibiting the unauthorized disclosure of confidential information, correct?

1180
03:43:00,860 --> 03:43:03,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you state what the specific laws po yung...

1181
03:43:03,100 --> 03:43:08,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Revised Penal Code under Article 229, for example, under Revelation of Secrets.

1182
03:43:08,200 --> 03:43:09,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1183
03:43:09,400 --> 03:43:18,250
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, Republic Act 3019, Section 3, Paragraph K, on unauthorized divulging of confidential information, correct?

1184
03:43:18,250 --> 03:43:18,850
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1185
03:43:18,850 --> 03:43:29,710
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: and you being a public officer under 6713, alam nyo rin po na hindi po pwedeng basta-basta mag-disclose without the authority ng mga confidential information. Tama po ba?

1186
03:43:29,710 --> 03:43:30,250
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po.

1187
03:43:30,250 --> 03:43:40,940
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. So, batay po dito, pinapahalagan po talaga ang confidentiality pagdating sa mga classified information na ito. Tama po ba? You would agree with me?

1188
03:43:41,760 --> 03:43:42,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po.

1189
03:43:42,570 --> 03:44:05,210
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes. Now, let's go to the Joint Circular that we have been mentioning since yesterday. Ito pong Joint Circular No. 2015-01. And I'm referring to the circular with which we have pre-marked as D-1-136 for the defense, Your Honors. And I think we will be flashing that on the screen as well.

1190
03:44:06,740 --> 03:44:22,020
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ito naman po yung pag-usapan natin. I just wanted you, Mr. Witness, to give us the definition of confidential funds. Diyan po sa circular na yan under, I think it's page 2, item 3.7. Can you please read it for the record?

1191
03:44:23,340 --> 03:44:35,470
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under 3.7, confidential fund refers to the lump sum amount provided as such in the GAA for NGAs. in appropriation ordinances for LGUs and in the COBs for GOCCs for their confidential expenses.

1192
03:44:35,870 --> 03:44:46,130
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Salamat po, Mr. Witness. At pagdating po, nabasa nyo po yung word na lump sum. Ibig po sabihin ito, buong halaga, buong

1193
03:44:47,920 --> 03:44:53,370
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: amount, as opposed to having line items for expense. Tama po ba?

1194
03:44:56,480 --> 03:44:57,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Lump sum. Lump sum.

1195
03:44:57,900 --> 03:44:58,570
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Opo.

1196
03:44:58,570 --> 03:45:10,080
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At based on your experience, pag ang pinag-uusapan po natin ay confidential funds, Pagdating po sa pag-dispers nito, cash po ba ito? In the form of cash?

1197
03:45:11,630 --> 03:45:13,210
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: What expense

1198
03:45:13,210 --> 03:45:13,830
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: are you

1199
03:45:13,830 --> 03:45:16,990
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: paying? Confidential funds in general. Cash po ba ito?

1200
03:45:17,470 --> 03:45:23,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala pong specific provision kung anong type po yung ibabayad.

1201
03:45:23,770 --> 03:45:28,670
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. But item 6 provides for the guidelines on cash advances, correct?

1202
03:45:40,960 --> 03:45:43,040
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document po, yes po. Yes po.

1203
03:45:43,160 --> 03:45:46,260
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And I refer you now to item 6.1.2.

1204
03:45:48,110 --> 03:46:07,890
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Diyan po, sinasabi po ng provision na yan na ang maari lang mag-avail ng cash advance pagdating sa confidential funds ay ang isang designated bonded special disbursing officer or SDO or kung wala mang ganong designated SDO ay ang head of agency, correct?

1205
03:46:10,090 --> 03:46:10,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1206
03:46:10,780 --> 03:46:20,340
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At kanina po, sabi nyo, binasa nyo bawat pahina noong mga sinabite sa inyo ng DepEd at OVP for their liquidation reports. Tama po ba?

1207
03:46:20,740 --> 03:46:21,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1208
03:46:21,440 --> 03:46:28,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At you would be aware na ang STO po para po sa OVP ay si Ms. Gina Acosta. Tama po ba?

1209
03:46:28,900 --> 03:46:31,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents submitted, yes po.

1210
03:46:31,500 --> 03:46:38,490
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, thank you. At pagdating naman po sa DepEd, Mr. Witness, ang STO po ay si Mr. Edward Fajarda. Tama po ba?

1211
03:46:38,610 --> 03:46:40,930
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents submitted po, yes po.

1212
03:46:41,150 --> 03:46:41,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes.

1213
03:46:41,620 --> 03:46:50,800
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So based on that, Tama rin po ba na sila ang maging payees ng mga cheque na inilabas ng DepEd para sa cash advance?

1214
03:46:50,800 --> 03:46:51,920
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1215
03:46:51,920 --> 03:46:57,400
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po. At tama rin po na silang nag-encash ng mga cheque dahil silang payee.

1216
03:46:57,400 --> 03:46:58,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1217
03:46:58,400 --> 03:47:01,790
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So they complied with 6.1.2, correct?

1218
03:47:04,550 --> 03:47:05,870
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: What do you mean complied po?

1219
03:47:06,030 --> 03:47:12,490
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Complied with the requirements of 6.1.2 na ang SDO po ang kumuha ng cash advance at siya po nag-encash ng cheque.

1220
03:47:14,000 --> 03:47:27,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please misleading. That's not the only requirement in 6.1.1. 6.1.2, Your Honor. There are other requirements here. Can counsel be specific? I'm

1221
03:47:27,660 --> 03:47:27,840
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: just

1222
03:47:27,840 --> 03:47:28,400
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: asking, Your

1223
03:47:28,400 --> 03:47:28,640
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor.

1224
03:47:28,820 --> 03:47:35,580
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: This is a blanket he is saying, and so therefore, there is compliance here. In particular.

1225
03:47:36,240 --> 03:47:38,520
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you. I appreciate po the... What does counsel

1226
03:47:38,520 --> 03:47:39,480
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: for respondent say?

1227
03:47:39,890 --> 03:47:53,940
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I appreciate naman po the objection of the good counsel. So I will be more specific. Tama po. Nag-comply po ng SDO ang payee sa cheque at ang SDO pong nag-encash. Yun lang po. Just on that part.

1228
03:48:01,010 --> 03:48:06,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents, si SDO yung payee ng cheque and yung nag-encash nung cheque. Okay. Thank

1229
03:48:06,970 --> 03:48:16,010
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: you po. Now, I'll refer you to item 6.1.5 of the Joint Circular. Can you please read just the first sentence of that provision?

1230
03:48:17,680 --> 03:48:21,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Cash advances shall be limited to the requirements for three months. Thank

1231
03:48:21,560 --> 03:48:36,350
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: you, Mr. Witness. So tama po ba ang pagkakaintindi ko na para sa cash advance at any one time, ang maximum na pwede mo lang ma-cash advance ay yung requirements mo para sa tatlong buwan ng confidential operations?

1232
03:48:36,350 --> 03:48:36,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based

1233
03:48:36,800 --> 03:48:36,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: on

1234
03:48:36,940 --> 03:48:37,240
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: this

1235
03:48:37,240 --> 03:48:39,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: provision po, yes.

1236
03:48:40,020 --> 03:48:45,100
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At tatlong buwan po is equivalent to one quarter of a year, tama po ba?

1237
03:48:45,100 --> 03:48:46,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1238
03:48:46,270 --> 03:48:59,610
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Now, base po dyan sa provision na yan, nakasulat na ang maximum amount ay para sa tatlong buwan. Pero meron po bang provision dyan na nagbabawal na gamitin ito in perhaps 60 days?

1239
03:49:01,670 --> 03:49:02,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po.

1240
03:49:02,500 --> 03:49:04,970
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Meron po bang nagbabawal na gamitin ito in 11

1241
03:49:04,970 --> 03:49:05,800
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: days?

1242
03:49:05,800 --> 03:49:13,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala din po. Kaya hindi po namin sinama sa findings namin yung 11 days na disbursement. It's just a statement of fact po on the AOM.

1243
03:49:13,350 --> 03:49:13,630
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank

1244
03:49:13,630 --> 03:49:21,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: you for confirming that, Mr. Witness. Familiar po kayo bilang isang CPA sa accrual method of accounting?

1245
03:49:21,200 --> 03:49:22,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1246
03:49:22,500 --> 03:49:26,380
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Can you just, in simple terms, because I'm not even a CPA, just

1247
03:49:26,380 --> 03:49:30,880
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: give us a glimpse kung ano ibig sabihin. Ano ba ang accrual

1248
03:49:30,880 --> 03:49:31,640
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: method of accounting?

1249
03:49:34,310 --> 03:49:44,640
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kapag sinabing accrual method of accounting, yung expenses ay nirecord upon incurrence, not upon payment.

1250
03:49:45,260 --> 03:49:53,760
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Opo, okay. So, dito po ba, pwede po ba yung parang I'm just a simple-minded person? Parang buy now, pay later? Ganon?

1251
03:49:55,730 --> 03:49:59,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala po yan sa joint circular so I am not authorized to answer

1252
03:49:59,590 --> 03:50:28,600
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: that question. I will leave it at that. Punta na lang po tayo sa liquidation. Sa liquidation po, under the joint circular, that's under 6.2.2, correct? Under 6.2.2, if I may just refer you to that provision, dapat po maliquidate o magsumite ng liquidation report ang isang agency na may confidential intelligence funds within 30 days after the close of a quarter.

1253
03:50:30,500 --> 03:50:31,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po ba?

1254
03:50:31,900 --> 03:50:36,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Tatlo po yung nakalagay dito, hindi lang po the... 30 days after every quarter.

1255
03:50:36,700 --> 03:50:38,340
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Sige po, please enumerate for us.

1256
03:50:38,660 --> 03:50:58,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under 6.2.2 of the Joint Circular, all cash advances for CF and IF shall be liquidated within 30 days after every quarter or from the approved target date of completion of the project or activity or after the cash advance had been fully utilized, whichever comes first in accordance with the procedures as stated. Okay, thank you po.

1257
03:50:59,240 --> 03:51:12,260
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ngayon po, papakita ko po sa inyo yung liquidation report na isinumite ng OVP for their fourth quarter confidential funds 2022. Maybe this time we could just ask our assisting counsel, Your Honor, to hand the document.

1258
03:51:13,090 --> 03:51:15,030
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Assisting counsel for the other side may

1259
03:51:15,030 --> 03:51:15,550
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: also approach.

1260
03:51:18,560 --> 03:51:27,540
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Maaari niyo po bang matukoy kung anong date po na-receive ng Kuwa Ikfaw itong liquidation report ng OVP?

1261
03:51:31,440 --> 03:51:35,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the transmitted letter, January 17, 2023.

1262
03:51:36,965 --> 03:51:40,745
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For our understanding, what exhibit number?

1263
03:51:40,846 --> 03:51:44,947
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ah, sorry. Thank you for reminding me, Your Honor.

1264
03:51:44,947 --> 03:51:45,453
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: You're welcome.

1265
03:51:45,453 --> 03:51:50,448
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: This is Exhibit D-1-4-OVP.

1266
03:51:51,427 --> 03:51:57,367
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: This is the prosecution's P-1-11-A. Ah, no, I'm sorry.

1267
03:51:57,690 --> 03:51:59,138
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: I'm sorry, what is it? D-1.

1268
03:51:59,138 --> 03:52:01,282
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Sorry. D-1-1. Sorry, Your Honor.

1269
03:52:01,282 --> 03:52:02,716
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: I was just corrected.

1270
03:52:08,538 --> 03:52:08,690
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel.

1271
03:52:08,690 --> 03:52:11,558
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: For the record, this is not a common exhibit.

1272
03:52:12,655 --> 03:52:13,263
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Duly noted.

1273
03:52:17,140 --> 03:52:28,600
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, base po sa date na nabasa n'yo, compliant po ba na within the 30-day period ay nakapagsumite sila? Yung act lang po ng pag-submission, na pag-submit rather, ng liquidation report.

1274
03:52:28,600 --> 03:52:30,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this document, yes po.

1275
03:52:30,400 --> 03:52:36,500
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes po. And kung mapapansin nyo po, dun po sa transmittal, meron pong isang checklist. Tama po ba?

1276
03:52:36,500 --> 03:52:37,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1277
03:52:37,500 --> 03:52:42,930
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And I will refer you now to item 6.2.2.3 of the Joint Circular.

1278
03:52:45,800 --> 03:53:13,700
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ayon po sa 6.2.3 ng nasabing Joint Circular 2015-01, ang gagawin po ng receiving officer ng COA-ICFAO, ay titignan po yung checklist, tapos susuriin po yung mga dokumentong isinumintay ng ahensya, yung mga attachments, kung pasok siya doon sa checklist of supporting documents na kinakailangan. Tama po ba?

1279
03:53:15,700 --> 03:53:17,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat your question po?

1280
03:53:17,300 --> 03:53:35,230
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ayon po, sa 6.2.2.3, ang receiving officer ng Kuwa Ikfaw ay titignan yung checklist And then, titignan din, susuriin yung mga naka-attached na dokumento kung compliance siya dun sa checklist. Tama po ba?

1281
03:53:35,230 --> 03:53:36,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, based on the joint circular.

1282
03:53:36,800 --> 03:53:45,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Based on that same provision, kung yun po ay kompleto, tatanggapin po ng Kuwa Ikfaw. Tama po ba?

1283
03:53:45,200 --> 03:53:46,030
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1284
03:53:46,030 --> 03:53:56,490
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At pag hindi po kompleto o meaning kulang po yung mga attached documents, yun po ay dapat ibalik ng Kuwa Ikfaw sa ahensya at hindi muna tatanggapin. Tama po ba?

1285
03:53:56,830 --> 03:53:59,070
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po. Based on this provision po.

1286
03:53:59,150 --> 03:53:59,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Apo.

1287
03:53:59,500 --> 03:54:08,990
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And in this case, because of the receiving stamp, would you say na tinanggap po ng ikfaw ang submission ng OBP?

1288
03:54:10,890 --> 03:54:14,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: As stamp po nung ikfaw, yes po.

1289
03:54:15,530 --> 03:54:44,300
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Witness. Now, basing on this document na natanggap ng Kuwa Ikfaw noong January 17, 2023, ang kanilang liquidation report, meaning kanila, meaning the OVP for the fourth quarter 2022 confidential funds. It took more or less eight months for COA to issue its official finding. Tama po ba?

1290
03:54:44,920 --> 03:54:45,620
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po.

1291
03:54:45,840 --> 03:54:52,740
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I am showing you a copy of the AOMs that you issued that were also presented yesterday.

1292
03:54:53,780 --> 03:54:55,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: May we know the exhibit numbers, Your Honor?

1293
03:54:55,960 --> 03:54:57,520
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes, Your Honor. I will get to that.

1294
03:55:01,570 --> 03:55:02,270
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Are

1295
03:55:04,190 --> 03:55:10,090
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: you showing the one for the OVP or the DepEd? OVP, Your Honor. OVP,

1296
03:55:10,150 --> 03:55:21,310
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: that would be... This is D-1-103-OVP, Your Honor, for the first AOM issued on September 14, 2023.

1297
03:55:25,410 --> 03:55:28,990
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: That's the counterpart of P-1-12-A.

1298
03:55:29,530 --> 03:55:39,150
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And isunod ko na po yung pangalawang AOM na na-issue on October 3, 2023. This is D-1-104-OVP for the defense.

1299
03:55:39,430 --> 03:55:42,370
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Which is P-1-12-B for the prosecution.

1300
03:55:43,070 --> 03:55:43,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you.

1301
03:55:45,850 --> 03:55:55,070
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, Mr. Witness, napansin ko na yung date is September 14, 2023, nang unan yung AOM. Tama po ba?

1302
03:55:55,450 --> 03:55:58,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po. And that was actually...

1303
03:55:58,440 --> 03:56:17,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Just a few days after the budget hearing of COA held August 24, 2023, kung saan may mga legislators that, well, asked COA to look into the OVP confidential funds. Are you aware of that? Just if you're aware.

1304
03:56:17,650 --> 03:56:19,020
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: I am not aware of that.

1305
03:56:19,020 --> 03:56:24,420
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That's okay. Now, I'll just move on to the AOMs themselves.

1306
03:56:26,600 --> 03:56:27,160
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now,

1307
03:56:29,160 --> 03:56:38,300
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Kahapon, nasasabi niyo po na nagkakaproblema tayo sa may nakita kayong finding doon sa physical and financial plan. Tama po ba?

1308
03:56:38,300 --> 03:56:39,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1309
03:56:39,500 --> 03:56:53,500
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At yan po ay nakasaad din sa inyong findings dyan. Tama po ba? You referred to, if I'm not mistaken, and please correct me if I'm wrong, item 4.2 of the Joint Circular.

1310
03:56:53,500 --> 03:56:54,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1311
03:56:54,700 --> 03:56:55,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po?

1312
03:56:55,120 --> 03:56:56,200
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1313
03:56:56,200 --> 03:57:05,690
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Maari nyo po bang basahin yung 4.2 ng Joint Circular para lang po sa kalaman natin lahat?

1314
03:57:07,060 --> 03:57:24,060
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under 4.2 of the Joint Circular, all allocations of CEF and or IF shall be supported with physical and financial plan indicating the proposed amount allocated for each program, project, and activity where disbursements pertaining to the CE and IA shall be based.

1315
03:57:24,300 --> 03:57:24,760
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama

1316
03:57:24,760 --> 03:57:24,920
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po.

1317
03:57:25,000 --> 03:57:35,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you po, Mr. Witness. Dito po sa kanilang physical and financial plan, the program stated is actually the good government program. Tama po ba?

1318
03:57:35,900 --> 03:57:37,470
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung binabasa ko lang.

1319
03:57:37,650 --> 03:57:38,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the document. Based

1320
03:57:38,990 --> 03:57:39,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: on the document.

1321
03:57:39,780 --> 03:57:46,410
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At ang expected outcome ay safe implementation of OVP initiatives and confidence building. Based on the document.

1322
03:57:46,410 --> 03:57:47,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the document.

1323
03:57:47,270 --> 03:57:47,910
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: At

1324
03:57:47,910 --> 03:57:57,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ang physical target will be number of areas with surveillance. and confidential activities conducted or monitored.

1325
03:57:57,400 --> 03:57:58,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po ba?

1326
03:57:58,650 --> 03:57:59,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes.

1327
03:57:59,450 --> 03:58:11,180
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: As well as the number of activities. Tama po ba? At ayon po dun sa binasa n'yo, wala naman pong guidelines on how specific it would be. Correct?

1328
03:58:11,520 --> 03:58:19,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Well, nakalagay po kasi dito, dapat i-indicate yung each program, activity, and project na pagbabasayan ng disbursement ng CF. Apo. I

1329
03:58:19,260 --> 03:58:24,530
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: won't argue with you. So, basically, Yung finding n'yo po is based on your assessment as an auditor.

1330
03:58:24,830 --> 03:58:29,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Well, since it is a plan, dapat po nakaindigay talaga dito kung paano nila gagastusin yung kanilang confidential fund.

1331
03:58:30,030 --> 03:58:31,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That's okay. Yes, I'll accept that answer.

1332
03:58:33,290 --> 03:58:43,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, nabanggit n'yo rin po na hindi po nagsubmit ng DEPs or Document Evidencing Payment. Tama po?

1333
03:58:43,830 --> 03:58:44,480
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1334
03:58:44,480 --> 03:58:48,130
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At yun po ay inilagay n'yo sa inyong AOM. Tama po?

1335
03:58:48,270 --> 03:58:48,630
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1336
03:58:49,330 --> 03:58:56,760
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: At nabanggit n'yo rin po na Sumagot ang OVP dito sa AOM na to. Tama po ba?

1337
03:58:56,760 --> 03:58:57,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1338
03:58:57,400 --> 03:59:03,780
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po. At pagdating po doon sa sunod na step, which is the notice of suspension, tama po ba?

1339
03:59:03,780 --> 03:59:04,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1340
03:59:06,070 --> 03:59:13,450
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Would you agree with me na hindi na po na-carry over yung issue doon sa physical and financial plan?

1341
03:59:13,450 --> 03:59:14,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1342
03:59:14,300 --> 03:59:16,870
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes. So, ibig sabihin, tinanggap nyo po yung explanation.

1343
03:59:17,370 --> 03:59:42,920
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Well, ang purpose po kasi namin kung bakit namin nirequire yung specific confidential activities dun sa PF is para makita kung paano gagastusin. noong OBP, yung kanilang confidential fund. Pero since nilagay naman na po nila doon sa kanilang reverse accomplishment report yung specific confidential activities and even submitted documentary evidence of payment, so hindi na po namin hinanap ulit yung physical and financial plan. Okay.

1344
03:59:42,980 --> 03:59:57,500
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Salamat po. Thank you for that answer. Ngayon po, kasi kanina, sinasabi, well kahapon actually, not kanina, sinasabi nyo walang sinabmit. Ang ibig nyo lang pong sabihin sa walang sinabmit is at the time. na bago kayong mag-issue ng AOM. Tama po ba?

1345
03:59:57,500 --> 03:59:59,930
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Walang sinubmit na DEP.

1346
04:00:02,920 --> 04:00:06,820
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, kasi sinamit po nila yung DEPs after we issued both AOFs po.

1347
04:00:06,920 --> 04:00:07,360
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Apo,

1348
04:00:07,460 --> 04:00:08,080
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: thank you po.

1349
04:00:08,700 --> 04:00:15,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ngayon, punta naman po tayo doon sa Notice of Suspension. Nandun pa po kayo eh, di ba, noong Notice of Suspension?

1350
04:00:15,950 --> 04:00:16,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes sir.

1351
04:00:16,400 --> 04:00:30,380
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And you suspended in audit the amount of 125 million. We are showing him a copy of the Notice of Suspension, Your Honor. This is Exhibit D-1-107-OVP for the reference of the Honorable Court.

1352
04:00:30,920 --> 04:00:35,240
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: NP-1-13-A, on the part of the prosecution. Okay.

1353
04:00:37,420 --> 04:00:50,350
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So, dito po, as you mentioned earlier, you were satisfied with already the submission of the accomplishment report ng OVP, that's why nawala na po yung issue sa physical and financial.

1354
04:00:50,350 --> 04:01:01,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po ako satisfied dahil compliant yung accomplishment report nila, kundi dahil nilagay lang nila yung specific confidential activities na pinaggamitan nung kanilang pondo.

1355
04:01:01,790 --> 04:01:05,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So, nawala na po yung sa PFP na findings sa AOM?

1356
04:01:05,200 --> 04:01:06,250
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the NS po.

1357
04:01:06,250 --> 04:01:08,000
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Based on the NS. Tama po ba?

1358
04:01:08,000 --> 04:01:08,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1359
04:01:08,650 --> 04:01:18,910
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Thank you. Ngayon, pagdating dito sa notice of suspension, I just wanted to focus on doon sa documentary evidencing success pagdating sa rewards.

1360
04:01:19,790 --> 04:01:20,410
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1361
04:01:20,810 --> 04:01:27,890
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Nabanggit nyo po, this is 4.8.5 paragraph B specifically of the Joint Circular, correct?

1362
04:01:28,190 --> 04:01:28,670
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1363
04:01:29,240 --> 04:01:54,080
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And yun din po yung nakasaad dito sa Notice of Suspension na reference, meaning the provision of the JC specified. At nabanggit nyo rin po kahapon na wala pong guidelines specifically under 4.8.5 that shows how specific you should be in terms of the documents evidencing success. Wala

1364
04:01:54,080 --> 04:02:03,970
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po akong na-mention na walang specific guidelines po. Ang sabi ko lang, hindi sinabi ko anong specific document yung hinihingi. Wala, may sinabi

1365
04:02:03,970 --> 04:02:06,110
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: ko po kayong walang prescribed format, basically.

1366
04:02:06,910 --> 04:02:24,590
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please misleading the witness to my recollection, did not say that. He said that in accordance with 4.8.5, these are the requirements, A, B, and C, and the submissions of the Vice President and the DepEd are not compliant, Your Honor. With

1367
04:02:24,590 --> 04:02:51,030
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: the indulgence of councils for the parties, Mr. Wamil, base po sa guidelines, hindi tulad nung ibang mga format na sinasubmit na may pro forma na nasa annex noong 2015-1, wala pong pro forma na pag-liquidate na dokumento, sangayon sa 4.8.5. Yes,

1368
04:02:51,030 --> 04:02:51,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Your

1369
04:02:51,150 --> 04:02:51,290
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Honor,

1370
04:02:51,370 --> 04:02:52,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: based on this provision.

1371
04:02:52,450 --> 04:02:56,700
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: May ibang provision bang nagre-require ng specific na paraan?

1372
04:02:56,700 --> 04:02:57,960
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala na po, Your

1373
04:02:57,960 --> 04:02:59,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Honor. Ito lang po. 4.8.5.

1374
04:03:00,000 --> 04:03:02,320
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Witness. You may proceed, counsel.

1375
04:03:02,780 --> 04:03:04,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you, Your Honor.

1376
04:03:06,060 --> 04:03:17,330
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, pagdating po sa OVP, alam nyo po ba kung sumagot sila sa notice of suspension na ito within the prescribed period given under the notice of suspension?

1377
04:03:18,690 --> 04:03:20,930
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Wala na po ako sa ICO nung submit sila ng

1378
04:03:20,930 --> 04:03:27,790
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: suspension. Okay po. So I will no longer ask you about that. Probably for another witness na lang po. Punta na lang po tayo sa

1379
04:03:30,710 --> 04:03:32,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: OVP Confidential Funds for 2023.

1380
04:03:36,810 --> 04:03:49,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: You confirm, Mr. Witness, na ang OVP Confidential Funds for 2023 ay nakapag-issue rin kayo ng AOMs for the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd quarter. Tama po ba?

1381
04:03:50,440 --> 04:03:58,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: For the 1st and 2nd lang po kasi yung 3rd quarter, nag-drop po ako and hindi ko na po naabutan yung issuance noon dahil nag-transfer out na po ako sa EFAP.

1382
04:03:58,560 --> 04:03:59,140
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. At

1383
04:03:59,140 --> 04:04:00,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: hindi nyo rin po alam kung

1384
04:04:01,800 --> 04:04:09,320
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Just if you're aware, kung sumagot ang OVP doon sa mga AOMs n'yo, hindi nyo rin po alam yan?

1385
04:04:09,320 --> 04:04:09,800
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1386
04:04:09,800 --> 04:04:17,180
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Sige. Diretso na lang po tayo sa DepEd para

1387
04:04:19,860 --> 04:04:31,880
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: hindi na po tayo tumagal. Sa DepEd po, nakapag-issue rin po kayo ng AOMs, tama? At least for the first and second quarter nandun pa po kayo.

1388
04:04:31,880 --> 04:04:32,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1389
04:04:32,360 --> 04:04:50,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po. And kanina po, pinag-uusapan po natin yung mga disbursement vouchers ng DepEd. Kung saan, natukoy n'yo doon na hindi compliant dahil MOOE yung nakasulat sa disbursement vouchers. Tama po ba? Naalala n'yo po yun?

1390
04:04:50,140 --> 04:04:53,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Um, sinagot ko lang po yung tanong ni Atty. Lorna kanina. At

1391
04:04:53,100 --> 04:04:56,320
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: ang tanong n'yo, ang sagot n'yo po, natatandaan n'yo po ba yung sagot n'yo?

1392
04:04:56,320 --> 04:05:00,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ay MOOE siya at hindi confidential funds. Yes po.

1393
04:05:00,500 --> 04:05:08,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, Mr. Witness, I will show you a page of the General Appropriations Act.

1394
04:05:09,750 --> 04:05:43,310
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: And for reference, Your Honors, this is Exhibit D-1-14-DE, Your Honors. And D-1-42-DE for the defense.

1395
04:05:44,110 --> 04:05:48,870
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel may approach the witness as well as counsel for the panel of prosecutors.

1396
04:05:53,930 --> 04:06:20,370
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So, dito po sa page 376, volume 118, number 52, General Provisions Act FY 2023, klarong-klaro po na ang confidential intelligence and extraordinary expenses is under maintenance and other operating expenses, which is the MOOE. Pero if I may clarify lang po kasi, yung

1397
04:06:20,370 --> 04:06:25,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: MOOE kasi is very broad. So hindi lang confidential fund yung covered niya.

1398
04:06:25,830 --> 04:06:27,250
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Apo, we will get to that, Your Honor.

1399
04:06:28,480 --> 04:06:28,920
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: DV,

1400
04:06:29,140 --> 04:06:29,720
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: sa

1401
04:06:32,890 --> 04:06:33,490
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: nakasulat.

1402
04:06:36,990 --> 04:06:37,590
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you.

1403
04:06:39,800 --> 04:06:44,100
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Kaya po dito, sa ating naging disbursement voucher,

1404
04:06:44,140 --> 04:06:48,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: With permission of Atty. Powa, yes.

1405
04:06:49,600 --> 04:06:50,220
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Observations and

1406
04:06:50,220 --> 04:06:51,160
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Manifestations, Counsel.

1407
04:06:51,630 --> 04:07:31,060
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, this document violates the original document rule. First, it is a photocopy. It is not even a photocopy of anything that is certified, Your Honor. Although, under the original document rule, you can dispense with the presentation of the original. If you present the original first and then substitute a copy, because a copy, a photocopy, is now considered likewise if properly authenticated as an original. This is a scrap of paper, Your Honor. We don't even know general appropriations of who, of which administration.

1408
04:07:32,970 --> 04:07:34,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: consisting of how many pages, Your Honor?

1409
04:07:36,990 --> 04:07:50,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: This particular document, Your Honor, should not even be testified to because we don't know its provenance. For all we know, we don't know where this document came from.

1410
04:07:50,600 --> 04:07:51,120
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: We

1411
04:07:51,120 --> 04:07:54,440
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: object, therefore, to this document, Your Honor.

1412
04:07:55,259 --> 04:07:56,845
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: What is the comment of Atty. Poa?

1413
04:07:56,845 --> 04:08:06,500
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honors, the copy we are showing is actually a certified true copy of the Commission on Audit, certified by Davin E. Bakay, Your Honor.

1414
04:08:06,500 --> 04:08:09,500
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Certified through copy of the part of the GA?

1415
04:08:09,500 --> 04:08:10,000
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Yes,

1416
04:08:10,040 --> 04:08:10,360
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor.

1417
04:08:11,570 --> 04:08:20,750
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Anyway, counsel, we will be ruling on the admissibility of these documents when the formal offer is made after the presentation of evidence in chief by the respondents.

1418
04:08:21,330 --> 04:08:59,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: We submit, Your Honor, but as another observation, Your Honor, we are aware, I think counsel is aware, that if you produce and you ask questions on a portion of a document, then you are compelled to produce the whole document, Your Honor. We want this on file. Produce the whole ga'a. For all we know, Your Honor, there may be provisions in that ga'a which contradicts the provision he's saying. So he is compelled under the rules, Your Honor. In addition to the rules of admissibility, he is compelled to produce the whole ga'a. And we want that on record, Your Honor.

1419
04:08:59,400 --> 04:09:07,100
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: presiding officer has already ruled. The manifestation and objection of the council is duly noted. Council may proceed. Thank you, Your Honor. And

1420
04:09:07,100 --> 04:09:29,250
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: under the disbursement voucher, exhibit D-1-58-DE, nakasulat po na MOOE, replenishment of cash advance under maintenance and other operating expenses authorized under page 376 of RA Number 11936, which is precisely the page of the GAA.

1421
04:09:30,940 --> 04:09:35,440
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pero marami po kasing nakalagay na expense items under MOUE in this page po.

1422
04:09:35,900 --> 04:09:36,380
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay.

1423
04:09:36,420 --> 04:09:36,700
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: We

1424
04:09:36,700 --> 04:09:38,300
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: will accept that answer, Mr. Witness.

1425
04:09:42,910 --> 04:09:46,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Now, Mr. Witness, pagdating po sa DepEd

1426
04:09:48,640 --> 04:09:54,200
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Confidential Funds, as you mentioned, you issued the first two AOMs.

1427
04:09:54,200 --> 04:09:54,850
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1428
04:09:54,850 --> 04:09:57,560
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Tama po. I mean, AOM for the first and second quarter.

1429
04:09:57,560 --> 04:09:58,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1430
04:09:58,500 --> 04:10:00,900
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Pero hindi nyo na po natanggap yung response?

1431
04:10:02,030 --> 04:10:02,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kasi wala

1432
04:10:02,790 --> 04:10:03,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: na kayo sa IGFAO?

1433
04:10:04,030 --> 04:10:04,370
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1434
04:10:04,450 --> 04:10:10,400
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: But would you know, just curious, would you know kung ano yung present status nitong mga AOMs na to?

1435
04:10:10,400 --> 04:10:13,550
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po. I don't have personal knowledge about that.

1436
04:10:13,550 --> 04:10:17,700
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. So you wouldn't know of whether may credit notice o wala?

1437
04:10:17,700 --> 04:10:18,600
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, sir.

1438
04:10:18,600 --> 04:10:24,990
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: But since you're an auditor, ano po ang ibig sabihin ng credit notice para sa isang

1439
04:10:24,990 --> 04:10:31,930
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: auditor? Kapag sinabing credit notice, yung document submitted ay already passed in audit na

1440
04:10:31,930 --> 04:10:32,150
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po.

1441
04:10:32,150 --> 04:10:34,400
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Opo, passed in audit, meaning allowed?

1442
04:10:34,400 --> 04:10:36,000
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, but subject

1443
04:10:36,000 --> 04:10:37,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: to the reopening of the audit later

1444
04:10:37,940 --> 04:11:03,830
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: on po. Okay, thank you Mr. Witness. Ngayon Mr. Witness, since hanggang dun lang naman yung naging saklaw talaga ng inyong service, I don't want to prolong this any longer. Gusto ko lang makita, based on your findings, AOM, di ba? Tapos yung notice of suspension para sa OVP and AOMs for DepEd. These are preliminary findings, correct?

1445
04:11:04,350 --> 04:11:11,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, kasi nirequire pa naman sa agency na mag-justify yung findings and submit the documents being sought po dun sa... Opo,

1446
04:11:11,430 --> 04:11:18,670
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: at based po dito sa findings n'yo, wala namang pong expressly nakasulat na may misappropriation at this point.

1447
04:11:19,790 --> 04:11:35,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Actually, yung presumption of misuse kasi nasa item 8.3 na kapag hindi nag-liquidate or failure of liquidation of the accountable officers upon due demand shall be a prima facie evidence that such fund has been put to personal benefit or misuse.

1448
04:11:36,030 --> 04:11:42,590
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: But I am just asking for the response na... Meron po bang expressly nakasulat sa mga findings niya?

1449
04:11:42,650 --> 04:11:45,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ask and answered, Your Honor. That is a presumption po.

1450
04:11:45,390 --> 04:11:51,310
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: May expressly po ba na nakasulat na may niisang kusing na napunta sa bulsa ng Vice Presidente?

1451
04:11:51,310 --> 04:11:55,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ask and answered, Your Honor. Wait, don't answer. That

1452
04:11:55,740 --> 04:11:59,380
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: question,

1453
04:11:59,440 --> 04:12:02,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, has been asked and answered. Sustained, Your

1454
04:12:02,020 --> 04:12:08,360
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Honor. Sustained, Counsel. I think what you're getting at. Modify. Modify your question. You can get it.

1455
04:12:08,700 --> 04:12:21,780
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. So, basically po, ang findings n'yo ay preliminary lamang. Wala pong any conclusive finding pa as to any misappropriation. Yun lang po ang tanong ko.

1456
04:12:22,710 --> 04:12:27,430
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang sabi kasi sa circular, upon failure to liquidate, meron kang presumption.

1457
04:12:27,770 --> 04:12:28,330
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ask

1458
04:12:28,330 --> 04:12:29,930
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: and answer, Your Honor. The

1459
04:12:29,930 --> 04:12:36,750
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: witness is not responsive. Kindly respond. I think the question is quite simple, Mr. Romil.

1460
04:12:37,390 --> 04:12:46,630
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Preliminary pa lang. So wala pang any conclusive finding as to any misappropriation. Yun na lang po. Para lang po masagot nyo na ng diretso.

1461
04:12:48,810 --> 04:12:51,810
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi naman po kasi kailangan i-state doon sa findings. Again, Your

1462
04:12:51,810 --> 04:12:57,410
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Honor, non-responsive. Let the Presiding Officer be the one to do it or try to do it.

1463
04:12:59,450 --> 04:13:16,180
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kapag ka nag-issue po kayo ng AOM, Audit Observation Memorandum, failure to liquidate na po ba yun? O may mga observation pa lang kayo? Kailan masasabing may failure to liquidate na no? Pag may notice of disallowance na, notice of suspension, o AOM pa lang?

1464
04:13:17,140 --> 04:13:28,940
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nakalagay po kasi sa Joint Circular, Your Honor, under 8.3, failure to liquidate by the accountable officer upon due demand shall be a prima facie evidence. Opo, again, Mr. Wamila,

1465
04:13:29,120 --> 04:13:38,300
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: yung pag-issue nyo po ba ng AOM? Pasok na sa failure to liquidate upon due demand o hindi pa po?

1466
04:13:38,300 --> 04:13:40,100
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi pa po sa AOM, Your Honor.

1467
04:13:40,100 --> 04:13:42,200
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Kasi wala pong due demand sa AOM?

1468
04:13:42,200 --> 04:13:43,000
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po.

1469
04:13:43,000 --> 04:13:47,430
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: At may sasabi mo rin bang wala pang failure to liquidate o meron na?

1470
04:13:47,770 --> 04:13:56,090
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pag sa AOM po wala, pero pag sa NS po, since meron ng first issuance which is considered as demand, so meron na po sa NS. So AOM

1471
04:13:56,090 --> 04:13:58,830
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: wala pa, pag NS, meron

1472
04:13:58,830 --> 04:14:10,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ng demand? At meron ng failure to liquidate. Opo, since sa AOM po, nirequire na silang i-justify and i-submit yung mga documents na hindi nila na-submit.

1473
04:14:10,790 --> 04:14:12,390
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Pero sa AOM, wala pa kang ganun.

1474
04:14:12,610 --> 04:14:13,310
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Your Honor.

1475
04:14:13,430 --> 04:14:33,820
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Okay. Counsel, your witness. Thank you. And lastly, gusto ko lang ito ma-clarify. Of course, the witness was a state auditor of the ICFAO. So, rekomendatory lang po ang function ninyo. Hindi po kayo nag-de-decide. Pagdating sa, lalong-lalo na, pagdating sa notice of this allowance. Tama po ba?

1476
04:14:34,880 --> 04:14:36,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po. It's the function of the commission proper.

1477
04:14:37,180 --> 04:14:41,040
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Wamil, Atty. Wamil. I thank you for your patience.

1478
04:14:43,000 --> 04:14:46,680
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That is all for this witness, Your Honor. Thank

1479
04:14:46,680 --> 04:14:51,040
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: you, counsel, respondent, redirect, if any, counsel, for the panel of prosecutors.

1480
04:14:51,580 --> 04:14:53,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yes, Your Honor, with your permission.

1481
04:14:54,060 --> 04:14:54,460
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel

1482
04:14:54,460 --> 04:14:54,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: may

1483
04:14:54,660 --> 04:14:54,980
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: proceed

1484
04:14:54,980 --> 04:14:55,140
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: with

1485
04:14:55,140 --> 04:14:55,260
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: her

1486
04:14:55,260 --> 04:14:58,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: redirect. Mr. Witness.

1487
04:14:59,960 --> 04:15:07,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Tinalong sa iyo ng counsel for the respondent kung meron kang special training para mag-audit ng confidential funds.

1488
04:15:09,250 --> 04:15:13,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Kailangan ba ng special training para mag-audit ng confidential funds?

1489
04:15:13,810 --> 04:15:15,770
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: No, ma'am. Hindi? Hindi po.

1490
04:15:15,950 --> 04:15:16,270
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

1491
04:15:16,860 --> 04:15:22,520
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At ang basihan mo, sinabi mo, when you answered is, ang

1492
04:15:24,440 --> 04:15:26,360
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: basihan mo ay itong joint circular.

1493
04:15:26,720 --> 04:15:27,160
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes.

1494
04:15:27,220 --> 04:15:29,540
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Now,

1495
04:15:34,140 --> 04:15:45,790
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: tinalong sa iyo ng counsel, Kung alam mo na ang office of the President ang siyang nagbigay ng grant,

1496
04:15:46,560 --> 04:15:47,400
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: tama?

1497
04:15:47,400 --> 04:15:49,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At ang sagot mo? Oo.

1498
04:15:49,990 --> 04:15:51,030
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question?

1499
04:15:51,190 --> 04:16:09,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: You answered on cross on the question of counsel for the respondent if you are aware that the grant was given to the Vice President by the President.

1500
04:16:11,600 --> 04:16:12,740
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po. And

1501
04:16:12,740 --> 04:16:13,440
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: you answered yes.

1502
04:16:13,740 --> 04:16:14,140
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po.

1503
04:16:14,990 --> 04:16:31,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pag binigay ba ng presidente, like in this instance, ang confidential funds, wala nang obligasyon mag-liquidate ang vice president ng paggamit niya sa confidential funds na yan?

1504
04:16:31,860 --> 04:16:32,560
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Meron po.

1505
04:16:33,160 --> 04:16:34,040
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Meron po siyang

1506
04:16:34,040 --> 04:16:35,540
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: obligation to liquidate.

1507
04:16:36,120 --> 04:16:46,840
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Obligasyon. Pag-grant ba ng Office of the President? Eh, exempted na ang Vice President na mag-submit ng mga dokumento. Your Honor,

1508
04:16:47,000 --> 04:16:49,180
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Council for Respondent? That is leading.

1509
04:16:50,370 --> 04:16:53,370
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Redirect, Your Honor, this, Council opened the door.

1510
04:16:53,390 --> 04:16:53,810
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Not covered

1511
04:16:53,810 --> 04:16:55,570
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: by cross, even, Your Honor. Your

1512
04:16:55,570 --> 04:17:01,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Honor, Council opened the door. Council opened the door to this line of questioning because he said, a grant was given by the President.

1513
04:17:01,890 --> 04:17:02,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Objection,

1514
04:17:02,330 --> 04:17:11,400
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: objection is overruled. Witness may answer if he knows. Kung alam mo, Mr. Wamil, Pakisagot po yung tanong ni Atty. Kapunan. Can you repeat the question, ma'am?

1515
04:17:13,390 --> 04:17:33,830
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang grant ba ng confidential funds ng isang presidente to a vice president, this president in particular, to the vice president, does it exempt the vice president for accounting, for the use of that confidential funds under your joint circular?

1516
04:17:34,230 --> 04:17:34,570
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: No po.

1517
04:17:35,940 --> 04:17:40,610
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So kailangan pa rin, sinasabi mo, na compliant? Mag-comply.

1518
04:17:40,770 --> 04:17:41,390
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi

1519
04:17:41,390 --> 04:17:50,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: lang ang Office of the President. Kung binigyan rin ng grant ang Department Secretary of Education, kailangan rin.

1520
04:17:50,390 --> 04:17:51,270
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1521
04:17:51,390 --> 04:17:56,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Bakit? Ano ba ang nature ng pondo na yan? Pera ba yan ng Presidente?

1522
04:17:57,170 --> 04:18:07,710
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Since ang confidential fund po ay public fund, so kailangan po ma-properly account. So kailangan nilang i-liquidate properly and completely yung kanilang cash advances from the confidential fund.

1523
04:18:07,950 --> 04:18:20,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So ang sinasabi mo? at nasa rationalityo ng Joint Circular. Section 1, public funds, public accountability, public officer. Tama?

1524
04:18:20,810 --> 04:18:21,530
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Opo.

1525
04:18:22,050 --> 04:18:27,130
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Walang exemption. Hindi exemption, si Sara Duterte para mag-account.

1526
04:18:27,390 --> 04:18:28,330
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1527
04:18:29,600 --> 04:18:31,840
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sinabi rin, counsel

1528
04:18:36,220 --> 04:18:50,310
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: for the Vice President also said, counsel for, yeah, the Vice President also said, Tinanong ka tungkol sa ano ba yung accrual method of accounting? Pakiulit, ano yung accrual method?

1529
04:18:50,730 --> 04:18:57,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Under the accrual method po, the expenses is recorded upon incoherence and not upon payment po.

1530
04:18:58,440 --> 04:19:08,410
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Allowed ba ito, itong accrual method of accounting, sa pag-evaluate ng confidential funds?

1531
04:19:08,670 --> 04:19:12,250
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: No, ma'am, kasi kailangan po talagang binayaran yung expenses po.

1532
04:19:13,330 --> 04:19:17,730
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So, hindi pwedeng accrual, parang lista. Hindi

1533
04:19:17,730 --> 04:19:18,570
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po pwedeng lista.

1534
04:19:18,790 --> 04:19:22,650
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi pwedeng lista-lista. Kung binayaran, dapat cash out.

1535
04:19:22,870 --> 04:19:23,510
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1536
04:19:24,230 --> 04:19:27,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At kung cash out, dapat may resibo.

1537
04:19:27,600 --> 04:19:28,550
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1538
04:19:28,550 --> 04:19:28,990
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: So,

1539
04:19:29,750 --> 04:19:35,570
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: hindi pwede ang accrual. Mr. Witness, tinanong rin sa'yo,

1540
04:19:37,890 --> 04:19:40,870
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: itong utilization

1541
04:19:43,110 --> 04:20:09,680
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: of confidential funds. Nakalagay utilization of confidential funds. Tinanong sa iyo ng counsel, hindi ba dapat confidential rin? Do not divulge information on the use of confidential funds. Tama ba ang interpretation ng counsel for the respondent?

1542
04:20:09,900 --> 04:20:17,940
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, that was not my interpretation. I was merely asking based on the... the quote was circular that he read, Your Honor.

1543
04:20:18,080 --> 04:20:18,460
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay.

1544
04:20:18,880 --> 04:20:22,500
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Just that. Just on that matter. Noted. Witness may answer.

1545
04:20:23,790 --> 04:20:24,850
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question, ma'am?

1546
04:20:24,990 --> 04:20:56,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ang tanong, sabi ng counsel, e confidential funds yan, bawal ang mag-reveal ng confidential information, citing certain provision and revised penal code, certain guidelines, which you haven't seen, pag confidential funds ba? lahat ng information na hinihingi sa inyo, kagaya ng sangginastos, yung milyon-milyon na yan sa medicine, ay, bawal yan. Confidential yan. Pwede ba yan, Mr. Witness?

1547
04:20:57,350 --> 04:21:10,790
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po. Since ang confidential fund po ay public fund, so dapat po ay properly accounted po ito. And since ang involved po ay confidential fund, so it must follow the strict accounting and auditing guidance po to prevent misuse.

1548
04:21:12,040 --> 04:21:17,750
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Confidential ba yung, uy? Bawal mo sabihin, sang grocery binili.

1549
04:21:17,990 --> 04:21:18,430
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: As

1550
04:21:18,430 --> 04:21:19,370
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: an answered, Your Honor.

1551
04:21:19,570 --> 04:21:20,010
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: As

1552
04:21:20,010 --> 04:21:20,590
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: an answered.

1553
04:21:21,370 --> 04:21:21,810
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: This is

1554
04:21:21,810 --> 04:21:29,170
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: food, Your Honor. And all the items there. Lahat ng items na sinabi natin. Food, medicine, transport. As an answered, Your

1555
04:21:29,170 --> 04:21:29,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor, I ask for a ruling.

1556
04:21:29,950 --> 04:21:35,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, I only ask for the medicine. I'm itemizing. As an

1557
04:21:35,050 --> 04:21:39,750
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: answered previously, Counsel. Counsel for Responder is correct. Currently move on to the next point.

1558
04:21:40,450 --> 04:21:42,050
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, sinabi sa'yo.

1559
04:21:44,260 --> 04:22:00,440
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: na dapat, since this is accountable, strict, sinabi mo na ang pagka-interpret ng joint circular na yan, eh, nandito sa, dapat strict, no?

1560
04:22:00,540 --> 04:22:01,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1561
04:22:01,380 --> 04:22:08,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Because public funds ito. Pag sinabi bang strict interpretation, and I will quote,

1562
04:22:11,940 --> 04:22:13,380
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: strict accounting,

1563
04:22:15,650 --> 04:22:29,070
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: The utilization of such funds is generally confidential and classified by nature, which requires not only strong internal controls.

1564
04:22:30,390 --> 04:22:31,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nakita

1565
04:22:31,350 --> 04:22:42,290
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: ba natin sa mga dokumento na sinubmit ng Vice President at ng Secretary of DepEd, nakita ba natin yung mga internal controls?

1566
04:22:42,900 --> 04:22:43,980
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po.

1567
04:22:44,120 --> 04:22:44,800
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Bakit?

1568
04:22:47,630 --> 04:23:01,950
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, the witness is incompetent to answer because he only based his audit on the documents provided. He has no knowledge on the internal controls of the Department of Education or the Office of the Vice President, Your Honor. If

1569
04:23:01,950 --> 04:23:02,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: the

1570
04:23:02,490 --> 04:23:03,090
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: witness

1571
04:23:03,090 --> 04:23:11,290
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: knows based on his observation of the documents submitted to him, only in so far as that is concerned, Mr. Wamel, give me an answer.

1572
04:23:11,590 --> 04:23:19,210
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents, may mga... Deficiencies pa rin po na-noted. So, it can be inferred na hindi strong yung kanilang internal control.

1573
04:23:19,630 --> 04:23:22,110
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Ano mga deficiencies na na-notice mo?

1574
04:23:22,570 --> 04:23:29,850
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yung kanilang mga documents, some of the documents ay hindi compliant dun sa requirements ng Joint Circular 2015-01.

1575
04:23:31,900 --> 04:23:33,540
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Acknowledgement receipts na walang dates?

1576
04:23:33,940 --> 04:23:39,220
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po. Walang date. Yung iba naka-date ng 2023 even if the period covered ay 2022.

1577
04:23:41,530 --> 04:23:49,710
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Liquidating documents para sa... Submitted 2023 para sa period 2022. May internal control ba yan?

1578
04:23:50,530 --> 04:23:54,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Actually, nasubmit naman po nila on time yung kanilang liquidation.

1579
04:23:54,910 --> 04:23:57,630
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Mga acknowledgement receipts na walang signatures?

1580
04:23:58,270 --> 04:23:59,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1581
04:23:59,210 --> 04:24:00,730
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Internal control ba yan?

1582
04:24:01,980 --> 04:24:05,020
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: That should have been prevented by a strong internal control.

1583
04:24:05,940 --> 04:24:08,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nakalagay rin dito in this section.

1584
04:24:12,480 --> 04:24:33,110
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Strict auditing rules to prevent mishandling and... improper application of the funds. So, sinabi mo na dapat strict ang compliance. Ikaw pa, as a state auditor, meron ka bang diskresyon sa pag-apply ng rules na to?

1585
04:24:33,970 --> 04:24:36,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Can you repeat the question, po? Okay.

1586
04:24:36,850 --> 04:24:44,890
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: You said that the basis for your evaluation are the express provisions of these rules.

1587
04:24:45,250 --> 04:24:45,750
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1588
04:24:45,940 --> 04:24:47,840
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Do you exercise any discretion?

1589
04:24:50,400 --> 04:24:57,880
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: We exercise professional judgments. Kailangan po namin i-evaluate if yung documents ay compliant sa requirements.

1590
04:24:58,940 --> 04:25:00,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Professional judgment.

1591
04:25:00,600 --> 04:25:01,180
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

1592
04:25:01,180 --> 04:25:01,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

1593
04:25:01,400 --> 04:25:04,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: But is this judgment based on personal opinion?

1594
04:25:04,500 --> 04:25:05,180
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi

1595
04:25:05,180 --> 04:25:05,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po.

1596
04:25:05,520 --> 04:25:11,420
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Is this judgment based on, ayoko yung mukha ni tong officer na to, bias? Is it based on bias?

1597
04:25:11,740 --> 04:25:11,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po.

1598
04:25:11,900 --> 04:25:15,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: What is it based on? Your professional judgment is based on what?

1599
04:25:15,930 --> 04:25:23,290
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Professional judgment is based on the experience and the applicable laws, rules, and regulations.

1600
04:25:25,910 --> 04:25:31,880
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. Counsel also mentioned 3.9, which is confidential expenses.

1601
04:25:34,380 --> 04:25:36,580
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I don't think I mentioned that, Your Honor.

1602
04:25:37,540 --> 04:25:38,980
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Then I will mention it.

1603
04:25:40,370 --> 04:25:42,090
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Not subject of the cross,

1604
04:25:42,170 --> 04:25:45,150
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Your Honor. Are you referring to the JMC, Counsel?

1605
04:25:45,510 --> 04:25:46,550
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please.

1606
04:25:48,120 --> 04:25:59,700
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: accounting, this council asked on how confidential expenses or funds are being accounted for. This is germane to the questions on cross.

1607
04:26:00,040 --> 04:26:04,040
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: No, my question, counsel, is what 3.9 are you referring to? 3.9 of what?

1608
04:26:04,040 --> 04:26:06,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 3.9 of the Joint Circular, Your Honor.

1609
04:26:06,720 --> 04:26:07,660
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Is there one?

1610
04:26:08,300 --> 04:26:20,300
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: It's confidential expenses, which is, it refers to those expenses pertaining related to surveillance activities, etc., Your Honor. Your

1611
04:26:20,300 --> 04:26:23,020
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Honor, beyond the scope of the cross, Your Honor.

1612
04:26:23,260 --> 04:26:30,760
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please. He opened the door. He says, confidential funds. He says, confidential funds, do not disclose information.

1613
04:26:31,120 --> 04:26:36,740
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Your Honor, please, we have to put a limit to at least, you know, apply what is in the rules of court suppletorily, Your Honor.

1614
04:26:36,740 --> 04:26:49,450
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Subject to the discretion of the court, the redirect and cover matters, not... Covered by the cross. The same is true with your accrued cross, counsel, later on. We submit, Your Honor. Counsel may proceed with her question. Witness may answer.

1615
04:26:49,670 --> 04:27:10,350
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Okay. In confidential expenses 3.9, nakalagay dito, in your evaluation of confidential, or liquidation of confidential funds or confidential expenses, nakalagay dito, are intended to support the mandate or operations of the agency, Mr. Witness.

1616
04:27:10,350 --> 04:27:11,190
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1617
04:27:11,190 --> 04:27:20,510
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Nasa mandato ba ng office ng vice president ang magkaroon ng confidential funds?

1618
04:27:20,870 --> 04:27:23,990
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Calls for an opinion, Your Honor, that the witness is not qualified to answer.

1619
04:27:24,090 --> 04:27:28,570
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: It's confidential, Your Honor. He knows what are allowed, what are not allowed.

1620
04:27:32,020 --> 04:27:52,500
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Objection sustained. Witness is not competent to answer whether or not it is part of the OVP's function, much less a DepEd, to have confidential funds. That he did not see any confidential funds when he was with Kowa Ikfaw does not mean that it is allowed or not allowed. Kindly move on to your next point, counsel, please.

1621
04:27:53,370 --> 04:27:56,190
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: You also mentioned that you

1622
04:28:03,870 --> 04:28:09,780
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: were asked about 4.2. Correct?

1623
04:28:09,780 --> 04:28:10,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1624
04:28:10,780 --> 04:28:11,520
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: I

1625
04:28:11,520 --> 04:28:12,100
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: confirm that.

1626
04:28:12,340 --> 04:28:25,740
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And in 4.2, it says there, shall be supported with physical and financial plan. Indicating the proposed amount allocated for each program, activity, and project.

1627
04:28:26,570 --> 04:28:27,370
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1628
04:28:28,860 --> 04:28:55,500
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ito ba at ang sinabi ng counsel eh, pinakita naman sa'yo yung dokumento. Bakit hindi mo siya, bakit? Why are you saying that there is no indication of what these projects are? What the disbursements pertain to? And what the confidential expense is based on? Why did you say that there is no?

1629
04:28:57,060 --> 04:29:03,440
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Dahil hindi po naka-indicate dun sa kanilang physical and financial plan yung specific confidential activities.

1630
04:29:04,060 --> 04:29:07,280
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi pa pwede ang substantial compliance dyan?

1631
04:29:09,130 --> 04:29:12,230
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kasi ang requirement mo ng Joint Circular ay strict compliance.

1632
04:29:12,750 --> 04:29:15,000
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Strict, hindi substantial.

1633
04:29:15,000 --> 04:29:15,710
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

1634
04:29:15,710 --> 04:29:15,890
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

1635
04:29:16,170 --> 04:29:18,070
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Now, in

1636
04:29:21,010 --> 04:29:23,610
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: 4.8.5,

1637
04:29:33,020 --> 04:29:34,280
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: counsel

1638
04:29:34,280 --> 04:29:51,720
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: makes mention in his cross that sa office of the Vice President, ang SDO, Senior Dispersing Officer, Special, SDO, IC Acosta, tama?

1639
04:29:52,750 --> 04:29:54,010
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Sa OBPS, ma'am.

1640
04:29:54,010 --> 04:30:01,020
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At sa DepEd ay ang SDO ay si Fajarda. Tama?

1641
04:30:01,020 --> 04:30:01,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

1642
04:30:01,420 --> 04:30:01,640
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

1643
04:30:01,680 --> 04:30:09,660
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At tama daw sabi ng counsel na tama lang talaga na sila yung payees.

1644
04:30:09,660 --> 04:30:10,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1645
04:30:10,840 --> 04:30:12,840
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Implying na silang tumanggap.

1646
04:30:13,860 --> 04:30:14,780
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1647
04:30:15,040 --> 04:30:21,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Implying na, ito ba, pag silang tumanggap, sila lang nakakaalam?

1648
04:30:22,020 --> 04:30:23,000
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po.

1649
04:30:23,140 --> 04:30:23,620
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Hindi.

1650
04:30:24,650 --> 04:30:25,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Kasi based on

1651
04:30:25,350 --> 04:30:25,650
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: the

1652
04:30:25,650 --> 04:30:36,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Joint Circular, si head of the agency po yung may responsibility to oversee the agency-wide use of the confidential fund and to ensure compliance with the requirements of the Joint Circular.

1653
04:30:43,050 --> 04:30:45,310
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sino ang boss?

1654
04:30:47,990 --> 04:30:52,090
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sino ang head of agency ng Office of the Vice President?

1655
04:30:52,450 --> 04:30:54,410
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Si Vice President Sara Duterte po.

1656
04:30:54,650 --> 04:31:07,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: At nakalagay dito sa Sinayat na Provision 4.8.5, nakalagay, as among the requirements, approval by the head of agency. Tama?

1657
04:31:08,380 --> 04:31:09,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1658
04:31:10,200 --> 04:31:21,540
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Ito. At nakita naman natin sa mga documents na pinisend natin, eh lahat may approval ng head of agency si Sara Duterte. Tama?

1659
04:31:22,600 --> 04:31:24,180
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Yung accomplishment report.

1660
04:31:24,180 --> 04:31:24,360
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes,

1661
04:31:24,360 --> 04:31:24,500
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: ma'am.

1662
04:31:24,580 --> 04:31:33,490
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Sa accomplishment report. Hindi lang sa OVP, sa DepEd. Meron nakalagay. Approved, attested, certified, correct. Sino ang nag-certify?

1663
04:31:33,490 --> 04:31:43,450
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Even yung certification po nung accountable officer on the utilization of the confidential plans of both the OBP and DepEd ay attested po ni Vice President.

1664
04:31:43,710 --> 04:32:05,920
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: So even if counsel says the SDO is Acosta for the OBP and the SDO for the DepEd is Fajarda, still the head of the agency, who in all the documents we have seen, signed, attested, approved, certified, is Sara Duterte as Vice President and as Secretary of the DepEd, correct?

1665
04:32:06,280 --> 04:32:07,840
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on the documents, yes ma'am.

1666
04:32:11,140 --> 04:32:25,440
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: On 8.3, tinanong sa'yo, conclusive ba? 8.3, you mentioned prima facie findings. Tinanong sa'yo, is this conclusive?

1667
04:32:26,970 --> 04:32:29,210
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Hindi po. Ito'y prima facie po.

1668
04:32:29,450 --> 04:32:51,900
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Pero miski na prima facie findings. Meron bang presumption? Is there a presumption of innocence here? Is there a presumption of guilt? As a matter of fact, expressly says, there is a presumption of misuse and that it is used for personal benefit. Tama?

1669
04:32:52,180 --> 04:32:54,760
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Based on this provision po, yes ma'am.

1670
04:32:55,020 --> 04:33:02,460
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: And so far, unless proven otherwise, that presumption still holds.

1671
04:33:04,390 --> 04:33:15,600
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: is presumed to have misused or to have used it for personal benefit, Mr. Witness. Correct?

1672
04:33:15,820 --> 04:33:16,300
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1673
04:33:16,360 --> 04:33:19,330
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Based on 8.3. Correct?

1674
04:33:19,550 --> 04:33:20,110
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, ma'am.

1675
04:33:20,130 --> 04:33:22,850
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: No further questions, Your Honor. Mayroon pa daw.

1676
04:33:23,110 --> 04:33:24,230
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Counsel, recross.

1677
04:33:24,230 --> 04:33:25,920
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Recross just two points, Your Honor.

1678
04:33:25,920 --> 04:33:26,290
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Just

1679
04:33:26,290 --> 04:33:26,890
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: two quick points. Counsel,

1680
04:33:26,950 --> 04:33:28,500
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: respondent, may proceed.

1681
04:33:28,500 --> 04:33:48,420
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Unang-unal sa lahat po, ukol po doon sa acknowledgement receipts. Pagdating po sa mga undated na nabanggit nyo naman at nasa report nyo naman, you would confirm na sumugot ang OVP pero hindi nyo niya inabutan ang sagot or meaning hindi nyo na alam kung sumugot man ang OVP dun sa notice of suspension?

1682
04:33:48,900 --> 04:33:50,480
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, hindi ko naman nabutan.

1683
04:33:50,540 --> 04:34:07,920
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So probably for another witness. Ngayon dun sa unang sinabi po ng kagalang-galang ng si Atty. Capunan sa pagiging exempt, niminsan ba humingi ang exemption? ang vice-presidente sa audit ng kanyang confidential funds?

1684
04:34:08,860 --> 04:34:22,260
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Ang humingi po ng, actually, meron nag-request po na kung pwedeng audit query na lang yung i-issue instead of AOM. So parang exception po yun dun sa provision ng Joint Circular na AOM yung i-issue.

1685
04:34:22,360 --> 04:34:29,650
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: Ang exemption po yung tinatanong ko. Just an exemption on the audit itself. The conduct of the audit, meaning nagsubmit po ba sila ng liquidation reports?

1686
04:34:29,650 --> 04:34:30,350
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, po.

1687
04:34:30,350 --> 04:34:33,150
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: nag-responde po ba sila sa AOM n'yo?

1688
04:34:33,150 --> 04:34:34,580
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes po, pero hindi pa rin po

1689
04:34:34,580 --> 04:34:36,420
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: sila compliant sa requirements.

1690
04:34:36,540 --> 04:34:42,850
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: No, Your Honor, I'm not asking that. I'm just asking for, nag-submit ba sila? Did they respond to your AOMs?

1691
04:34:42,850 --> 04:34:44,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Nag-submit pero hindi po full yung submission.

1692
04:34:44,900 --> 04:34:47,720
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: So they did not ignore your AOMs?

1693
04:34:47,720 --> 04:34:48,670
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Pero hindi pa rin

1694
04:34:48,670 --> 04:34:48,870
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: po full

1695
04:34:48,870 --> 04:34:50,050
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: submission yung ginawa nila.

1696
04:34:50,050 --> 04:34:50,410
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: The

1697
04:34:50,410 --> 04:34:58,770
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: question, Mr. Wamilis, did they submit a response? Whatever your evaluation of the response, complete or incomplete, is another matter.

1698
04:34:59,110 --> 04:35:02,590
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, they submitted a response po dun sa AOM. So

1699
04:35:02,590 --> 04:35:03,510
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: they submitted a response.

1700
04:35:03,920 --> 04:35:08,380
Atty. Michael Wesley Poa: That is all for recourse, Your Honor. Again, Mr. Witness, thank you for your patience. With the

1701
04:35:08,380 --> 04:35:21,820
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: permission of our colleagues, it's 2.30 and session was called by the Senate President to be convened at 3 p.m. May we continue with our interjections for this witness tomorrow.

1702
04:35:24,100 --> 04:35:28,520
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: And I have listed already those who would like to make interjections.

1703
04:35:31,730 --> 04:35:59,020
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: In this order, Senator Tulfo, Rafi, Senator Bamacino, Senator Pangilinan, Senator Erwin Tulfo, Senate President, Senator Jewel Villanueva, Senator Judge Riza Ontiveros, Senator Judge Padilla, and Senator Judge Aimee Marcos, and Senator Judge Ejercito. In that order. It'll be in the journal anyway tomorrow.

1704
04:36:01,830 --> 04:36:06,950
Atty. Lorna Patajo-Kapunan: Your Honor, please, before any other announcements, can we ask that the witness be excused?

1705
04:36:07,370 --> 04:36:28,050
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes, the chair was about to do that. Mr. Walmel, you're excused for the day. Kindly be back again tomorrow without need or necessity of issuing another subpoena. Can we rely on your word that you will be attending tomorrow's hearing for the continuation and hopefully closure of your testimony before the impeachment court?

1706
04:36:28,050 --> 04:36:28,900
Atty. Roderick C. Wamil: Yes, Your Honor.

1707
04:36:28,900 --> 04:36:34,080
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Asahan po namin. You are excused, sir. Thank you po sa inyong kooperasyon at oras at pasensya.

1708
04:36:35,682 --> 04:37:34,390
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Before we adjourn, the Chair notes that the next witness, Ms. Cylene May L. Del Campo, was only subpoenaed to appear before the court on August 3 and August 4. The clerk is thereby directed to issue, and the Sergeant-at-Arms to serve, a subpoena for the appearance of Ms. Cylene May L. Del Campo of the COA-ICFAO, which subpoena shall remain valid from August 5, 2026 until August 11, 2026. With respect to Marevic Pareja, who was subpoenaed for August 4 and 5, the issuance of subpoena will depend on the Chair's ruling on the motion for judicial notice of the prosecution which the Chair will rule upon after hearing the respondent. Orally or through a written manifestation or motion regarding this matter tomorrow before we adjourn. The

1709
04:37:34,810 --> 04:37:52,110
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: panel of prosecutors, with the permission of the lead prosecutor, allow the presiding officer to finish with one other administrative matter. The panel of prosecutors also filed a motion to set a conference for the transfer of exhibit markings.

1710
04:37:55,240 --> 04:38:32,550
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: to be set at 4 p.m. on Wednesday, tomorrow, August 5, 2026 for the transfer of markings from copies previously marked during the pre-trial order. Given that this is administrative in nature, the request and the motion is granted. The counsel-respondent is directed as well as counsel for the panel of prosecutors to assign lawyers for this change of markings. to be conducted again for the record at 4 p.m. of Wednesday, August 5, 2026. That is tomorrow.

1711
04:38:33,090 --> 04:38:33,610
Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: Your Honor?

1712
04:38:33,990 --> 04:38:35,010
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Yes. May

1713
04:38:35,010 --> 04:38:36,650
Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: I be recognized, Your Honor? Good afternoon.

1714
04:38:36,890 --> 04:38:44,990
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Before the lead counsel for the respondent, I think the lead prosecutor earlier asked for recognition. What is the pressure of the Honorable Luistro?

1715
04:38:45,230 --> 04:40:06,150
Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: First of all, Your Honor, we just want to acknowledge your just... Your pronouncement earlier about the setting of the transfer of marking of exhibits that will be on August 5, 4 p.m. This pertains particularly to exhibit P4-3 and series through P4-35B. Second, Your Honor, we also acknowledge the pronouncement of the impeachment court relative to the oral or written comment of the defense to the earlier motion of the prosecution that was filed on August 3. That is to take judicial notice of the hearings conducted both by the House Committee on Good Government and Public Accountability and the Committee on Justice, Your Honor. That's for the record. And third, Your Honor, this is in line also with Another pronouncement of the impeachment court in compliance with, relative to our compliance to the five-day notice rule. We will be submitting the list of witnesses for next week as well as the request for issuance of subpoena tomorrow, August 5, because the same will depend on... On the conclusion of the testimony of Ms. Cylene del Campo as well as the ruling of the impeachment court with regards to the motion to take judicial notice on the hearing of the two committees of the House of Representatives, Your Honor.

1716
04:40:08,450 --> 04:40:09,050
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: That's all?

1717
04:40:09,610 --> 04:40:10,370
Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: Yes, Your Honor.

1718
04:40:10,490 --> 04:40:14,610
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Julie noted. What is the pleasure of the lead counsel of the respondent?

1719
04:40:14,880 --> 04:42:23,050
Atty. Sheila C. Sison: Thank you, Your Honor. First, with respect to the motion to set confidence for the transfer of civic markings, I just note that under paragraph 3 on page 2 of this motion, the prosecution is also requesting for the portion of Arturo Lascagna's affidavit, paragraphs 270, 270 paragraph B, and 270 paragraph D. to be also marked. Now, I would just like to put on record that we're objecting even to the marking of this particular exhibit consistent with the ruling of this court when we objected to the reading session of the NBI Director Melvin Matibag when he testified and was cross-examined by Defense Counsel Attorney Mark Bin Luan. So we object to the marking of This portion of Arturo Lascagna's affidavit. As of this point, no witness has yet testified on this affidavit and it is on record, if we review the record of the court, that that supposed affidavit was unnotarized and was not signed by anybody, let alone identified by any competent witness. And also, Your Honor, the motion is to set conference for the transfer of exhibit markings. Now, this presupposes that there has already been a marking on the original document. Now, if there is no competent witness who has identified the affidavit of Las Cañas, then there is no reason for a supposed transfer of exhibit markings. We object. We object to item number three of this motion. We will not agree. If the presiding officer will rule to allow even the pre-marking or the marking of this item under this motion, then we would like to have our continuing objection to the allowance of even the marking of this particular exhibit put on record, Your Honor. Thank you.

1720
04:42:25,230 --> 04:42:26,910
Rep. Gerville “Jinky Bitrics” R. Luistro: May we respond, Your Honor?

1721
04:42:29,130 --> 04:43:12,820
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: To afford the court some time to rule on the matter, let the marking and premarkings proceed tomorrow without prejudice to the ruling of the chair with finality in open court with respect to the objection raised by the lead counsel for the prosecutor at the appropriate time. Most likely tomorrow also. No, probably on Monday, counsel, before we finally act on it after the marking and premarking to be done. tomorrow. Again, that is without prejudice to noting the continuing objection of the counsel for the respondent on the matter. In any way, we will be finally ruling on the admissibility of these documentary pieces of evidence once formal offer is made.

1722
04:43:13,060 --> 04:43:14,360
Atty. Sheila C. Sison: We will do that, Your Honor. Thank you.

1723
04:43:14,420 --> 04:43:24,200
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Thank you, counsel. If there are no other matters to be taken up, again, with the permission of my colleagues, fellow senator-judges, let their interjections be done.

1724
04:43:26,090 --> 04:43:42,890
Sen. Francis "Chiz" G. Escudero: Tomorrow, when we resume at 10pm, we will be convening at 3.30pm for the advice of our Senate President this afternoon. Trial is adjourned until tomorrow, August 5, at 10am in the morning.